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Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

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Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#51

Post by dimgl »

romanovcode wrote: post #32

>Trails is built and maintained by former members of the Sails.js core team Just no. I was working with Sails.js for about a year now on production systems - it's horrible. Without a doubt I can say that it's the worst framework I've ever worked with. Especially their so called "orm" - we actually had to switch it off and work with pure mysql queries instead because it can't even do migrations (it deletes everything…

I try to stay away from big frameworks that try to do this very thing because development and production experiences are two completely different things. I've been through nightmares scenarios where things don't work correctly or new technical debt is introduced after deployment and smaller frameworks usually alleviate that pain point for me.

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#52

Post by nodenodenode »

rattray wrote: post #30
traviswebb wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will be awhile before it's fully production-ready of course, but we'll begin using it internally for developing new projects after our 1.0-beta release in February. One note: we're using Hapi by default, but koa and express4 will be supported as well. This is part of our modularity difference.

Can you please mention these things on the README?

But that would discourage developers adopting the framework with an expectation of usability, who once invested will have no choice but to fix the project's bugs. This is a notable feature of the JS world nowadays: You never get to know when a project is stable, it just "is."

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#53

Post by edwinnathaniel »

My new/current job is 100% JavaScript and I have been thinking to choose NodeJS and either React/EmberJS/AngularJS for my newbside project (a typical CRUD app) that I will have to maintain for a very long time. I almost chose Sails because Express is too low level/too simple.

Lately I've been reconsidering my options ever since there were a few HN posts related to my choice of stack that seem to conflict with my requirements: side project (meaning little effort) and long term maintenance (meaning stability, documentation should still exist for perhaps prior versions, relevant articles, examples from the Internet). Real time isn't a requirement, REST API isn't a requirements (yet), so I guess that minimize the need of NodeJS. I also haven't found a good case/example of code sharing between client and server side neither I heard people reaping tons of benefit from the principle since most front end framework forces the user to subscribe to their model/paradigm that may not work well with the back end code.

I quickly realized that perhaps Rails or the good old Java (with SpringMVC) seem to satisfy the requirement.

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#54

Post by platz »

DonHopkins wrote: post #35
andrewchambers wrote: post #14

Can someone define "modern" in this context for me?

MVC is old and obsolete cargo cult technology. The phrase "Modern MVC Web Framework" is lipstick on a geriatric pig, like "Modern Waterfall Software Development Paradigm". Unless by modern they mean modern as in modernism, that began in the 1870s as a self-consciousness and irony concerning literary and social traditions. [1] In the same sense that the art style and technology in Fallout 4 is "modern". [2] MVC framew…

When I hear the Facebook-React people talk about "MVC", it seems like their experience of the term is from Native-UI frameworks, especially those with active Views that call themselves "MVC". Then we have "Javascript MVC" frameworks like Angular, which have "bindings" and this makes them MVC. Then I think about the Server-side web programmers (i.e. Rails) which are also "MVC" that render the whole response for a request.. the view is often just a template. This is also "MVC". Basically the term has completely lost it's meaning at this point.. It's simply a pejorative term now, because we don't take the time to name/reveal the particular things we don't like about certain frameworks, we just call them MVC.

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#55

Post by jessaustin »

dimgl wrote: post #49
DonHopkins wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MVC is old and obsolete cargo cult technology. The phrase "Modern MVC Web Framework" is lipstick on a geriatric pig, like "Modern Waterfall Software Development Paradigm". Unless by modern they mean modern as in modernism, that began in the 1870s as a self-consciousness and irony concerning literary and social traditions. [1] In the same sense that the art style and technology in Fallout 4 is "modern". [2] MVC framew…

If it's obsolete, what should replace it?

Here's one idea: http://cycle.js.org/model-view-intent.html

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#56

Post by sebular »

edwinnathaniel wrote: post #53

My new/current job is 100% JavaScript and I have been thinking to choose NodeJS and either React/EmberJS/AngularJS for my newbside project (a typical CRUD app) that I will have to maintain for a very long time. I almost chose Sails because Express is too low level/too simple. Lately I've been reconsidering my options ever since there were a few HN posts related to my choice of stack that seem to conflict with my requ…

I would check out the loopback framework: http://loopback.io/

It's built on top of express.js and offers some of the more "Railsy" features that express lacks. Also supports this idea of shared models between the client and server (going for that whole code reuse thing you're talking about).

The company was also bought by IBM so I'm feeling pretty confident that it's going to keep getting regular updates and long-term support. They offer a bunch of enterprise-type features for the paid version, but the free one will be enough for your needs.

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#57

Post by _qbjt »

edwinnathaniel wrote: post #53

My new/current job is 100% JavaScript and I have been thinking to choose NodeJS and either React/EmberJS/AngularJS for my newbside project (a typical CRUD app) that I will have to maintain for a very long time. I almost chose Sails because Express is too low level/too simple. Lately I've been reconsidering my options ever since there were a few HN posts related to my choice of stack that seem to conflict with my requ…

As a full time JavaScript developer, I would never choose Node.js for the back end if I had the choice. Elixir or Ruby all the way.

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#58

Post by im_down_w_otp »

roblabla wrote: post #34
romanovcode wrote: post #32

>Trails is built and maintained by former members of the Sails.js core team Just no. I was working with Sails.js for about a year now on production systems - it's horrible. Without a doubt I can say that it's the worst framework I've ever worked with. Especially their so called "orm" - we actually had to switch it off and work with pure mysql queries instead because it can't even do migrations (it deletes everything…

While I haven't played with Sails.JS, I've heard many people complain about how bad it was. However, just because the people building this new framework used to work on the Sails.JS Framework, you're going to dismiss it as being "automatically bad" ? I didn't look at Trails.JS so I don't know how it looks, but this kind of attitude seems extremely toxic and detrimental to the Open Source space. It makes me sad this i…

Can I dismiss it because it's like the 50th "modern MVC framework" to be made for Node.js? Are all the other ones so hopelessly broken that it required making an entirely new one?

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#59

Post by luccastera »

pdappollonio wrote: post #17
traviswebb wrote: post #7

All -- Keep in mind that Trails.js is pre-release. We're releasing 1.0-alpha on January 8, which isn't too far away. For more info on our development schedule, see our roadmap: https://github.com/trailsjs/trails/blob/master/ROADMAP.md We'll be giving some talks on Trails the week of Jan 11th; we'll be visiting local Javascript groups in Detroit, Miami, and Los Angeles that week. If you're in the area, come hang out!

I'm interested in the Miami one. Any information?

I just announced the meetup. You can find it here: http://www.meetup.com/Miami-node-js-Meetup/events/227782873/

Re: Trails – Modern MVC Web Framework for Node.js

#60

Post by smokeyj »

im_down_w_otp wrote: post #58
roblabla wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I haven't played with Sails.JS, I've heard many people complain about how bad it was. However, just because the people building this new framework used to work on the Sails.JS Framework, you're going to dismiss it as being "automatically bad" ? I didn't look at Trails.JS so I don't know how it looks, but this kind of attitude seems extremely toxic and detrimental to the Open Source space. It makes me sad this i…

Can I dismiss it because it's like the 50th "modern MVC framework" to be made for Node.js? Are all the other ones so hopelessly broken that it required making an entirely new one?

Dismiss it, but you don't have to tell the entire world about your uninformed opinion. It's not as valuable as you suspect.
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