Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition • Hacker News Board

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#51

Post by melted » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:41 PM UTC

izacus wrote: post #43

melted wrote: post #40

I don't know about this article. I bough a 3rd gen Thinkpad Carbon earlier this year and Ubuntu runs better than Windows 10 on it. Not a single crash. The only thing that doesn't work out of the box is the fingerprint reader. Not that it doesn't have some rough edges, but this is enormous progress compared to just a few years ago, and the fact that it runs better than the OS _the laptop was designed for_ is a testame…

Your single laptop datapoint sure makes this article invalid :)

The article is just as data free as my single data point. My experience contradicts it. I use Linux _everywhere_ these days, on the desktop, on the laptop, and on my workstation at work. It works well. It's just not Windows, which seems to be the author's main consternation.

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#52

Post by nanny » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:43 PM UTC

et1337 wrote: post #26

jjuhl wrote: post #6

To me this reads as "I can't use hardware xyz on linux". Well, that's no surprise. There's "wxy" hardware that you can't use with Windows or OS X as well. Today Linux supports the same amount (or more) hardware that Windows does. Hardware support is not a reason to use or not use Linux. The software ecosystem is much more important - not to mention the freedom aspect...

I think just the opposite - most of my software runs on Linux, but hardware is the main obstacle. I've installed Linux many times on desktops and laptops, and I have yet to simply install a graphics driver and have it work first try. My laptop locks up the cursor after two minutes of use, doesn't support two-finger touchpad scrolling, and exhibits constant graphical artifacts, all under multiple driver and kernel com…

That used to be a problem, but I don't think it is any more. Linux "just works" on both my laptop (including sound, multitouch touchpad, wifi, and graphics, also when I'm not using it, I only ever put it to sleep by closing the lid, and I've never had a problem) and my desktop, which has an AMD graphics card (Radeon HD 7950) and an external USB audio interface (Focusrite Scarlett 2i2).

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#53

Post by geggam » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:44 PM UTC

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #29

geggam wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entry level mac mini is terrible and beach balls surfing. I am surprised they sell it. ( cant upgrade the memory either )

What would consider entry level? I use a Mac mini from 2012 (i7 with 8GB) every day and I'm not seeing any beach balls unless Flash crashes some web page.

http://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/mac-mini?product=MGEM2LL/A...

Dont add any extras... its simply not usable on the net

Hardware

    1.4GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5 (Turbo Boost up to 2.7GHz)
    4GB 1600MHz LPDDR3 SDRAM
    500GB Serial ATA Drive @ 5400 rpm
    Intel HD Graphics 5000
    User's Guide (English)
    Accessory Kit

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#54

Post by aeturnum » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:44 PM UTC

geggam wrote: post #17

eropple wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW -- I have my own complaints about OS X (a lot of them), but I can't remember the last time I got beachballed, certainly not something like typing a URL.

The entry level mac mini is terrible and beach balls surfing. I am surprised they sell it. ( cant upgrade the memory either )

I'm not sure /which/ entry level mac mini you're talking about, but the current entry level ($500) is neck & neck with the $1000 model of 2012[0]. I wouldn't recommend the mac mini to someone trying to squeeze every last penny out of their computing dollar, but it's not a rip-off either.

[0] http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-3615QM-vs-Intel-Core-i...

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#55

Post by DangerousPie » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:44 PM UTC

thescriptkiddie wrote: post #39

wvenable wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's not uncommon to have to wait minutes for things to settle down after booting and logging in This is no longer my experience with Windows on an SSD. I'm always a bit shocked when I reboot and I'm back at my desktop in under 30 seconds. On a machine without an SSD, I'm annoyed at how slow everything is -- not just booting.

I've got a windows 10 machine with a pretty fast NVMe SSD. It takes 10 seconds to get to the login screen, and another three minutes to load up all of the services that are set to run on login. I'm convinced that the NTFS driver must be a nightmare of blocking I/O.

That's definitely not the norm. On both my Windows 10 machines the desktop becomes usable within seconds after login. Might be worth having a look at what's taking so long on your machine...

As far as I remember there is even a Microsoft tool that highlights startup jobs that are slow to run, isn't there?

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#56

Post by keithpeter » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:45 PM UTC

Sir_Substance wrote: post #46

jjuhl wrote: post #6

To me this reads as "I can't use hardware xyz on linux". Well, that's no surprise. There's "wxy" hardware that you can't use with Windows or OS X as well. Today Linux supports the same amount (or more) hardware that Windows does. Hardware support is not a reason to use or not use Linux. The software ecosystem is much more important - not to mention the freedom aspect...

No, funtionality is important. It doesnt matter how free the software is if it doesnt work. I don't know where you live, but in both the countries I live in you cannot buy linux compatible wifi adaptors over the counter. I can't close my office or loungeroom doors at the moment, because none of the three wifi adaptors I own work with ubuntu, so theres a massive network cable snaking through both. The hardware compati…

"I can't close my office or loungeroom doors at the moment, because none of the three wifi adaptors I own work with ubuntu, so theres a massive network cable snaking through both."

Homeplug[1] devices any good?

I used a pair of those for a bit to save putting cat 5 in the wall (I'm lazy about DIY). Worked OK but I didn't need super-fast.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HomePlug

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#57

Post by astazangasta » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:46 PM UTC

crgabrieljr wrote: post #8

Tried double-tapping in the article text to get it to reflow, and got one of those bogus popups claiming my phone is infected with a virus. Thanks for trying to make my new year interesting. :-(

Yeah, is this considered acceptable in today's world? I goto your site and get attacked by your ad service?

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#58

Post by Semaphor » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:46 PM UTC

thescriptkiddie wrote: post #39

wvenable wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's not uncommon to have to wait minutes for things to settle down after booting and logging in This is no longer my experience with Windows on an SSD. I'm always a bit shocked when I reboot and I'm back at my desktop in under 30 seconds. On a machine without an SSD, I'm annoyed at how slow everything is -- not just booting.

I've got a windows 10 machine with a pretty fast NVMe SSD. It takes 10 seconds to get to the login screen, and another three minutes to load up all of the services that are set to run on login. I'm convinced that the NTFS driver must be a nightmare of blocking I/O.

There must be something wrong with your installation or you have an insane amount of services. I have around 16 auto starting background programs including MS SQL Server and it's about 5s to login screen and another 10-20 until chrome is running and I can start doing stuff.

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#59

Post by bryanlarsen » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:47 PM UTC

et1337 wrote: post #26

jjuhl wrote: post #6

To me this reads as "I can't use hardware xyz on linux". Well, that's no surprise. There's "wxy" hardware that you can't use with Windows or OS X as well. Today Linux supports the same amount (or more) hardware that Windows does. Hardware support is not a reason to use or not use Linux. The software ecosystem is much more important - not to mention the freedom aspect...

I think just the opposite - most of my software runs on Linux, but hardware is the main obstacle. I've installed Linux many times on desktops and laptops, and I have yet to simply install a graphics driver and have it work first try. My laptop locks up the cursor after two minutes of use, doesn't support two-finger touchpad scrolling, and exhibits constant graphical artifacts, all under multiple driver and kernel com…

The parent is correct, modern Linux supports a lot more hardware than any single Windows version. The difference is that Linux is much better at supporting old hardware, and Windows is slightly better at supporting new hardware. Try using a 20 year old non-generic printer on Windows 10, for example.

Re: Major Linux Problems on the Desktop, 2016 Edition

#60

Post by condescendence » Wed, Dec 30, 2015, 4:49 PM UTC

izacus wrote: post #48

condescendence wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contributors of distributions already have their goals and and sights set. Everyone knows these issues of linux, they've been ongoing for years. This list has been compiled many times, that's why I'm so harsh to it. It's literally as if someone just copied ans pasted. This is a direct copy from wikipedia: __________________________________________ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Linux Critics of Linux on t…

1.) "Everyone" is a very wide net to cast, considering people in THIS VERY comment thread try to prove how their personal GPU works so Linux is fine. 2.) It's a yearly review. The issues haven't gone away. That's why they're still listed, just because "everyone" knows them, they're still outstanding issues. You know, like GitHub issues - they don't go away UNTIL YOU FIX THAT.

facepalm

1)What are you even arguing? Yes some cards actually do work fine with linux I've had similar experiences

2) We have lists, and it's pretty funny they actually are Github issues!

https://github.com/linuxmint/Cinnamon/issues for example

As an actual linux developer, this webpage is fucking useless. It has no specifics on project or targets. Thats what a real development review is about. What do we have, what priorities should we set, and what should get done in the next month.

This article says "okay here are the issues" (yet again) but the author has no incite into the development teams or plans for any of the packages/projects he's talking about.