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How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

economist.com

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Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#81
post #3

Since the author of the article did not even bother linking to the teenagers' website or even showing some screenshots of the app, here are some links: - The Five-O app on Pinetart Inc. (the teenagers' company) website: http://pinetartinc.com/?p=44 - The Five-O app on Google Play: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.five_o - The "international contest for justice-related initiatives" mentioned in the ar…

It's a fundamental failure of journalism posted on the Internet to not actually link to the subject of your reporting.

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#82
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an American expat living in the UK, so I am interested in judging things on comparative rather than absolute terms. In the UK, the police are on track to have killed 3 people in 2015[1]. In the US, the police are on track to have killed 1,200 people[2]. Adjusted for population, the US has a police homicide rate that is 79 times higher than in the UK. In some places, police violence is now the no. 1 form of homici…

>> Actual homicide is just the tip of the iceberg, of course, but if this doesn't qualify as "significantly and often" then I'm not sure what does. Mainly because police departments do not keep these kinds of statistics, so the data is horribly incomplete. And as anybody knows, you can massage the data to show anything you want when you don't have the complete picture: Officials with the Justice Department keep no co…

> Mainly because police departments do not keep these kinds of statistics, so the data is horribly incomplete. And as anybody knows, you can massage the data to show anything you want when you don't have the complete picture:

That is true, but not to the US' credit. In the UK, the records are compiled nationally and are beyond question. There have been three fatal police shootings here in 2015; all of them were front-page national news.

The US keeps no such records, and until http://killedbypolice.net/ began compiling credible news reports, nobody was keeping national records. The numbers on killedbypolice.net are therefore an absolute minimum for how many people are killed by police in America. Killings which are not well-documented in the news aren't included. If the number is inaccurate, then the picture in America is even worse.

Undoubtedly many of them are justified. America is awash in guns, and if somebody is shooting at you, then undoubtedly you have the right to shoot back. However only 48% of those who were killed had a firearm on or near them (it doesn't necessarily mean they were using it).[1] Many of the remainder are classified as being "armed", but that includes cases like this mentally ill man who was killed for holding a screwdriver in an unthreatening manner[2], so those numbers should be considered suspect. Finally, there are hundreds of killings every year of people who cannot be considered "armed" by any definition. Many of these are well-documented on video; if you want to spend the next few hours watching snuff films, they're easy enough to find.

The punishment for the overwhelming majority of these killings is a paid vacation for the murderer.

Something is desperately wrong with America.

1: http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2015/jun/0...

2: https://www.rt.com/usa/252533-dallas-screwdriver-shooting-ju...

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#83
I'm with Temporal that this will be negatively biased against the police. There will be some good ratings of good cops at least while this is a fad. There might be a percentage that do it consistently. Yet, most people are going to make this the goto app for ranting against the police. These rants will vary in accuracy.

Overall, I mainly see it being an app for collecting negative claims about police rather than truly holding them accountable. Body cams and attorney's present are accountability. This isn't.

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#84
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you think you should also include crime rate in this analysis? And split it by areas. I don't think anyone would find if suspicious that cops kill more people in crime-infested poor neighborhood with constant gang violence than in a high-middle class London suburb.

No. The prevalence of crime should not in itself be an excuse for the police to use lethal force. Or maybe you meant to argue that crime rate is an indicator for general lawlessness of the population, in which case crime rate and police violence are two sides of the same coin?

No. Crime rate is correlated with amount of situations where use of lethal force is necessary.

How is it not obvious?

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you think you should also include crime rate in this analysis? And split it by areas. I don't think anyone would find if suspicious that cops kill more people in crime-infested poor neighborhood with constant gang violence than in a high-middle class London suburb.

Then why aren't more people killed by police in some of the drug infested UK neighbourhoods?

Aren't?

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#86
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, he won't recognize them. As he is running the plates and driver's license through the official public computer system, he will also be whipping out his personal phone to run that name through a few private databases, run by ex-cops, with subscription access granted only to cops and ex-cops. Those databases will tell him, essentially, "This guy created a popular app that puts your job under a microscope. Also, he…

Sounds like an excellent idea for a honeypot. Are you building it?

I'd be a bit late to that party.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/8632c929c3ba4773a2e130689f4b8...

http://consumerist.com/2014/05/19/private-companies-building...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/2014/09/06/st...

https://desertsnow.com/

https://bales.org/

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#87

I'm with Temporal that this will be negatively biased against the police. There will be some good ratings of good cops at least while this is a fad. There might be a percentage that do it consistently. Yet, most people are going to make this the goto app for ranting against the police. These rants will vary in accuracy. Overall, I mainly see it being an app for collecting negative claims about police rather than trul…

Bias is easily removed, just select your zero and scale.

Human reaction to police actions is a precious feedback that can make them better, not throw them all to jails. What's good in police that is officially correct, but unaccepted by the entire society?

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#88
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So even though in my example the problem is minor and mostly random in nature I would be more likely to agree with you if the problem was actually random in nature. But instead I feel that bad policing in the US is based on personal biases of the individuals involved (conscious or subconscious) and institutional issues that affects certain demographics more than others.

I assure you that in my example the problem is totally random - it is my example after all :). In the US it's probably less so. Institutional issues one can deal with, but what to do about "personal biases of the individuals involved (conscious or subconscious)"? We can try to minimize it, but one has to accept that it'll hit diminishing returns after some time. But my point was about 'rrmm wrote - that "Getting ever…

>you have to be 100% totally damn sure that there is a problem in a first place and that you're not inventing it

Sounds a lot like a 'no true Scotsman' fallacy.

Everything from apartments to restaurants to taxi and semi drivers have ratings or a feedback system and it hasn't brought any of those systems to a grinding halt.

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#89
post #3

Since the author of the article did not even bother linking to the teenagers' website or even showing some screenshots of the app, here are some links: - The Five-O app on Pinetart Inc. (the teenagers' company) website: http://pinetartinc.com/?p=44 - The Five-O app on Google Play: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.five_o - The "international contest for justice-related initiatives" mentioned in the ar…

It's a fundamental failure of journalism posted on the Internet to not actually link to the subject of your reporting.

Often, I experience it as deliberate. There is so much rehashing; if you link to the source, people may simply go there -- especially if it proves to be better than your hash.

Re: How three teenagers invented an app to police the cops

#90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then why aren't more people killed by police in some of the drug infested UK neighbourhoods?

Aren't?

Aren't is a contraction and means are not. You could have googled that in less time than it took to post your comment.
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