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Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

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Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#111

Post by Gracana »

spo81rty wrote: post #92
herbig wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a very liberal persion, but I really like Rand Paul. I just wish he didn't think gays were going to burn in hell for all eternity, or at least would stick to libertarian principles on the issue and let people live how they want to live. The same with abortion laws. I'd be way more into supporting him if he would concede he doesn't agree personally, but that people shouldn't be forced by the government to live acc…

I've always felt that was how Paul believed. He thinks marriage is between a man and a woman but doesn't think the government should be involved in defining it.

In my experience, people with those beliefs (conservative views on marriage && thinks government should not be involved) tend to protect the status quo. It's nice to say that the government shouldn't be involved, but meanwhile it would be really great and really easy if we just allowed same-sex couples to have the same rights. But that's the arbitrary (read: not at all arbitrary) point where "government involvement" becomes too much for them.

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#112

Post by agildehaus »

spo81rty wrote: post #92
herbig wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a very liberal persion, but I really like Rand Paul. I just wish he didn't think gays were going to burn in hell for all eternity, or at least would stick to libertarian principles on the issue and let people live how they want to live. The same with abortion laws. I'd be way more into supporting him if he would concede he doesn't agree personally, but that people shouldn't be forced by the government to live acc…

I've always felt that was how Paul believed. He thinks marriage is between a man and a woman but doesn't think the government should be involved in defining it.

He's open to letting state government define it. I'd say that's something everyone who is for gay rights should be against.

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#113

Post by jessriedel »

tptacek wrote: post #101
jessriedel wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, I don't necessarily disagree, but why tack CISA onto the omnibus budget bill if not to avoid publicity? There was no compromise justification (i.e. no argument that CISA + budget bill would pass even though neither would pass alone), correct?

It's the end of the year and they're trying to get shit wrapped up. CISA and PCNA weren't controversial except on message boards. They passed with overwhelming support, positive media coverage, and the overt support of the President.

Although I'm happy to admit that there was no major public pushback against CISA because no one in the public cared, I'm not convinced that it had public support or positive media coverage. I typed "CISA" into Google news, and these were first articles and opinion pieces that came up on the mainstream (not tech-related) news sites. (I couldn't find any positive publicity at all.)

--

Washington Times: "ISA cyber bill squeezed into omnibus spending plan | Lawmakers have contentious cybersecurity legislation into an omnibus spending plan..."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/16/cisa-cyber-b...

Huffington Post: "Congress Ties Controversial Cybersecurity Bill To Key Spending Package | And critics are not happy about it."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cisa-omnibus-spending-bi...

The Guardian: "Congress just revived the surveillance state in the name of 'cybersecurity'"

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/16/congres...

CNN: "Congress, don't be fooled by cybersurveillance bill"

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/18/opinions/polis-cybersecurity-l...

International Business Times: "Controversial Cybersecurity Bill CISA Passes House, Takes One Step Closer To Becoming Law"

http://www.ibtimes.com/controversial-cybersecurity-bill-cisa...

Washington Times: "Lawmakers line up to complain about last-minute inclusion of cyber bill CISA in omnibus"

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/dec/17/lawmakers-li...

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#114

Post by [deleted] »

um_ya wrote: post #84
oceanstone wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bernie Sanders and Tammy Baldwin are pretty consistent when it comes to supporting privacy and the internet. They were actually the only two Senators who voted against the "Freedom" Act [1] who also supported net neutrality [2]. Both also voted against the "Patriot" Act in 2001, while they served in the House [3]. [1] http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_c... [2] http://www.baldwin.senate.gov/pr…

Don't forget Rand Paul

[deleted]

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#115

Post by cpursley »

randomname2 wrote: post #59
tptacek wrote: post #45

CISA passed the Senate with almost 3:1 bipartisan support in October. PCNA, the House's (worse) version of CISA, passed with similar margins in April. Obama has publicly supported the bill all year. As much as HN and Twitter wants to believe CISA was enacted in some shady backroom deal, the process that actually occurred, including publicly available amendments and months-long review, is pretty close to "Schoolhouse…

The 14 votes against, FWIW: Baldwin (D-WI) Booker (D-NJ) Brown (D-OH) Coons (D-DE) Franken (D-MN) Leahy (D-VT) Markey (D-MA) Menendez (D-NJ) Merkley (D-OR) Paul (R-KY) Sanders (I-VT) Udall (D-NM) Warren (D-MA) Wyden (D-OR) https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151022/10133932597/cisa-...

I think this list reinforces the fact that there's only one reasonable presidential candidate on each party's ticket.

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#117

Post by Navarr »

spo81rty wrote: post #92
herbig wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a very liberal persion, but I really like Rand Paul. I just wish he didn't think gays were going to burn in hell for all eternity, or at least would stick to libertarian principles on the issue and let people live how they want to live. The same with abortion laws. I'd be way more into supporting him if he would concede he doesn't agree personally, but that people shouldn't be forced by the government to live acc…

I've always felt that was how Paul believed. He thinks marriage is between a man and a woman but doesn't think the government should be involved in defining it.

I'm fairly sure he is content with the states defining it. I'm not sure I've heard whether or not he'd do anything concerning what the supreme court decided.

Follow up: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/06/rand-paul-comments-gay...

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#118

Post by cconroy »

oceanstone wrote: post #62
randomname2 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 14 votes against, FWIW: Baldwin (D-WI) Booker (D-NJ) Brown (D-OH) Coons (D-DE) Franken (D-MN) Leahy (D-VT) Markey (D-MA) Menendez (D-NJ) Merkley (D-OR) Paul (R-KY) Sanders (I-VT) Udall (D-NM) Warren (D-MA) Wyden (D-OR) https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151022/10133932597/cisa-...

Bernie Sanders and Tammy Baldwin are pretty consistent when it comes to supporting privacy and the internet. They were actually the only two Senators who voted against the "Freedom" Act [1] who also supported net neutrality [2]. Both also voted against the "Patriot" Act in 2001, while they served in the House [3]. [1] http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_c... [2] http://www.baldwin.senate.gov/pr…

Can you explain why you think Bob Kahn is against net neutrality (whereas Vint Cerf is for it)? I am not that familiar with this issue and the other sides arguments (against), but there are prominent people there.

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#119

Post by cpursley »

ekianjo wrote: post #109
herbig wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a very liberal persion, but I really like Rand Paul. I just wish he didn't think gays were going to burn in hell for all eternity, or at least would stick to libertarian principles on the issue and let people live how they want to live. The same with abortion laws. I'd be way more into supporting him if he would concede he doesn't agree personally, but that people shouldn't be forced by the government to live acc…

> at least would stick to libertarian principles on the issue and let people live how they want to live. Paul is a libertarian and believes that Government should not be involved in the private space, including marriage. I think that's a very reasonable position to have - and I don't think I have seen him saying anything against gays, but please provide a source if you have any.

Exactly, he (unfortunately) feels like he has to say these types of things to pander to the typical Republican voter. However, he's one of the only people out there talking about the real issue: should government be involved in the marriage business at all? Sure, Paul says some seemingly nutty stuff, but if we judge based on his voting record, he's easily the strongest Republican on personal liberty and right to privacy (not to mention a sane foreign policy).

Re: Obama Signs CISA Bill into Law

#120

Post by tptacek »

jessriedel wrote: post #113
tptacek wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the end of the year and they're trying to get shit wrapped up. CISA and PCNA weren't controversial except on message boards. They passed with overwhelming support, positive media coverage, and the overt support of the President.

Although I'm happy to admit that there was no major public pushback against CISA because no one in the public cared, I'm not convinced that it had public support or positive media coverage. I typed "CISA" into Google news, and these were first articles and opinion pieces that came up on the mainstream (not tech-related) news sites. (I couldn't find any positive publicity at all.) -- Washington Times: "ISA cyber bill…

All of these stories are just press hits for people like Amash and Wyden, whose PR strategies involve courting Internet privacy supporters.

There's nothing at all wrong with that.

Certainly, even when I disagree with them, I'd rather read Wyden and Amash talking points than hearing about why we should kill the families of ISIS members. And I mostly agree with Wyden!

But it's just worth remembering that no matter what had happened with CISA and PCNA, there were always going to be these stories. You take press hits when you can get them, and these were lay-up press hits.

The House and Senate bills passed with overwhelming support and significant media coverage, and Obama backed the bill. Nobody is hiding.

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