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Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

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Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#161

Post by scotty79 »

stcredzero wrote: post #129
CamperBob2 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, do you have an objective source of morality for us to refer to?

Most human beings and human societies agree on the same general points of morality. - Killing -- Try really, really hard not to do this! - Lying -- Please try really, really hard not to do this! Or there's George Carlin's formulation: "Really try hard to not be a jerk!" I think everyone has a pretty good idea of what this means, and most people agree on the broad outlines. The devil is in the details, of course. Then…

I think people have much more relaxed stance towards lying than you think.

Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#162

Post by makeitstop »

stcredzero wrote: post #95

I find that the most anti-intellectualism, cheap-shot emotional abuse, and stereotyping on the Internet is motivated by moral sentiments through online pseudo "activists" who are really working out their anger and self-esteem issues under the supposed imprimatur of one cause or another. This goes for select subsets of both ends of the political spectrum, and select subgroups on both sides of any hot-button issue. Att…

You call out activists, but this strategy of hate and othering is mostly used by esteblished political groups and religions.

They just don't have to be as aggressively vocal about it, because they already yield enough power and influence to use a more moderate tone of voice. But what they actually do is equally hateful and vitriolic.

Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#165

Post by gadders »

stcredzero wrote: post #95

I find that the most anti-intellectualism, cheap-shot emotional abuse, and stereotyping on the Internet is motivated by moral sentiments through online pseudo "activists" who are really working out their anger and self-esteem issues under the supposed imprimatur of one cause or another. This goes for select subsets of both ends of the political spectrum, and select subgroups on both sides of any hot-button issue. Att…

>>I find that the most anti-intellectualism, cheap-shot emotional abuse, and stereotyping on the Internet is motivated by moral sentiments through online pseudo "activists" who are really working out their anger and self-esteem issues under the supposed imprimatur of one cause or another.

I'm starting to come round to the Joe Rogan theory of these people - they are deeply unhappy, angry people with issues, but finding a "cause" lets them express these antisocial tendencies in a semi-legitimate way. Basically their chosen issue gives them an outlet for their asshole tendencies.

Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#166

Post by karmacondon »

stcredzero wrote: post #129
CamperBob2 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, do you have an objective source of morality for us to refer to?

Most human beings and human societies agree on the same general points of morality. - Killing -- Try really, really hard not to do this! - Lying -- Please try really, really hard not to do this! Or there's George Carlin's formulation: "Really try hard to not be a jerk!" I think everyone has a pretty good idea of what this means, and most people agree on the broad outlines. The devil is in the details, of course. Then…

I feel like you missed the point of the article. While the world agrees that killing, or generally being a jerk is bad, we are hopelessly divided on the issues like the death penalty, honor killing of rape victims, applying the death penalty to the mentally disabled, use of drones in armed conflicts, etc.

As the grandparent comment pointed out, there is no objective source of morality on any issue. As the OP pointed out, most people don't loudly proclaim themselves to be jerks. Outside of sociopaths and those with mental disorders, most people lie, kill and hate because they think it's somehow the right thing to do. Or because they can rationalize acting in their own self interest to be somehow fair or in the greater good.

Though the article tried to end on a positive tone, I found it to be pretty disheartening. It's easy to say "Don't be hateful", but much more difficult to say "Don't do what you think is right". Ain't no solution for that.

Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#168

Post by alvarosm »

knieveltech wrote: post #137
danharaj wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Lastly: From the tenor of your comment, it would seem that my writings have touched a nerve. Let's establish one thing first, and it's that I'm not a teenager and therefore my command of language is such that I have some degree of control over the tone I convey in writing. It does not take a struck nerve to litter someone's writing with fucks and write pointedly. Your writing style is as artificial as mine and I fi…

This comment and the one prior add quite a bit to the dialogue. These downvotes are unfortunate.

While I disagree with him, I disagree with HN's censorship more. It's disgusting that posts are grayed out or flagged all the time whenever someone has a strong opinion. Should we all avoid judging anything?? disgusting

Re: Most violence in the world is motivated by moral sentiments

#170

Post by epaga »

pekk wrote: post #77
russnewcomer wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that I expressed myself the best above based on your response, but partly that's because of the difficulty in discussing topics like this across religious traditions. I would disagree that violence is caused by the judgement, 'you are right, I am wrong'. I think that violence is ultimately caused by sin, vis a vis Augustinian total depravity. But the justification for violence, often among Christians, is…

Where "sin" means essentially not being Christian enough, I am skeptical that the correct diagnosis for violence is "sin" when people who identify as Christian do not seem especially less likely to commit violence than people who identify as adhering to some other worldview with moral entailments. Frankly, if you want everyone else to believe that Christians are less violent than people of other religions, you have t…

"sin means essentially not being Christian enough"

The Apostle Paul would strongly disagree with that definition, I think.

"The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost." http://ref.ly/1Tim1.15

Note his use of the present tense in that last phrase.

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