Being offended is not a condition imposed by another. It is a choice, and being offended is avoidable. My response to that student would be something like, "Isn't that great? Now you know how to repent." Might still warrant some research to see if the professor/preacher was overly harsh - I don't really like the emphasis on guilt, though it is important to recognize when you are wrong.
This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
211–220 of 707 posts
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#212It doesn't help that campuses increasingly operate like day cares: they treat adult students like children.
A great example is orientation. Throughout the US, until fairly recently (at my Alma Mater, SUNY New Paltz - it was 1973), orientation was 100% run by students with no state or 'administrative' involvement.
And it was an adult event. It involved camping, orienteering, and serious discussions about the life ahead. Now that the state is involved, it's a cringey PG-13 experience that leaves students completely disoriented and feeling like children.
The same is true of the way Student Union buildings are run today. And residence life. And university police. And campus dining. And many other facets of student life.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
What subject do you teach? I was talking to an old physics professor of mine and he said the same thing, but my former psych professor was completely the opposite. Maybe it's a subject-related issue?
I teach cultural studies-related things and nearly all of my friends who are college profs are as well. I talk about race and gender regularly. The only non-grade related complaint I've ever gotten was that I used swear words in class - which would be hard not to do when one of the readings was about swearing...
I'm not trying to be glib but in my experience it's cutural studies mentalities applied to hard science courses (like biology for non-majors) or artistic roundtable formats (like creative writing workshops) where issues of race, gender, and feelings are inappropriately applied as 'arbiters' of "how" things are to be discussed. My apology if not totally clear, but the jist of what I'm getting at is my impression of cultural studies is that the inherent inclusiveness of 'perspectives' doesn't really challenge students, but predominately allows an arena for affirmation. I suppose what I mean is that based on the nature of the subject matter, an excellent rhetorical essay framing genocide of a certain culture can't really be criticized as 'bad thinking' if the structuring of the argument and included reasoning are sound, though the very concept itself is abhorrent in its premise.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#214I find it baffling that there are people, in the real world, who somehow think that for unexplained reasons they have the right to not be offended or be made to feel uncomfortable. Somehow they believe that their feelings are the responsibility of everyone else.
While I sympathize with your viewpoint, perhaps I can shed some clarity on the other side. The concern is not feelings getting hurt, but rather physical security as a person of minority status. This is something that a white heterosexual middle-class male (such as myself) can probably never fully appreciate, but I try to sympathize. Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back yo…
I think the main issue here is the difference between physical discomfort and emotional/intellectual discomfort.
I think we've see so much physical discomfort forced on people and minorities that we try to overcompensate by making them COMPLETELY comfortable in every way. But feeling comfortable isn't always a good thing.
Pain from working out isn't a bad thing, it's actually a sign of something good, but many people avoid it. Pain from a beating is bad for two reasons, it strikes both the physical body and the emotional psyche of the recipient.
I think this is at the core of why people want to get rid of emotional damage, they don't realize that some pain teaches, and some harms. Something my football coach used to say to us. If you are hurt, get up and keep going. If you are injured you better get off of my field and rest.
The same is true for emotional damage. Some hurts but is good for you, and other injures a person. It is a thin line to tread but I think we are well past the point where people are mistaking hurt for injury.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
>University is for adults, not toddlers. Oh really, so university students are able to consume alcohol, right? edit: noun: adult; - a person who is fully grown or developed. - a person who has reached the age of majority. edit 2: "Longitudinal neuroimaging studies demonstrate that the adolescent brain continues to mature well into the 20s. This has prompted intense interest in linking neuromaturation to maturity of j…
So what? University still remains a place for adults. All sorts of odd laws and regulations pertain to institutions and other organizations notwithstanding.
University remains a place for adults who are not legally recognized as adults but are expected to fully act as adults. So consistent, much logic.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
While I sympathize with your viewpoint, perhaps I can shed some clarity on the other side. The concern is not feelings getting hurt, but rather physical security as a person of minority status. This is something that a white heterosexual middle-class male (such as myself) can probably never fully appreciate, but I try to sympathize. Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back yo…
> Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back you carried at all times in mixed-race race situations the possibility of being assaulted without recourse or lynched, or in present times accused and convicted of a crime you didn't commit or shot on sight for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. > Imagine what it is like to be Jewish and have 85% of your relatives systematic…
These things get carried forward culturally. The modern Jewish experience is very much rooted in the Holocaust, and the fear that it might happen again at any time. The Holocaust was not the first, or even the largest such pogrom -- note that there is a word coined precisely to describe genocide events targeting jews -- it was just the closest to the current generation of jews in western countries. It's hard to explain politics regarding present-day Israel without this context, for example. So yes, many Jews can relate with growing up being told that there were exterminators around every corner and that does have consequences..
Likewise, although I have less personal experience here, even if lynchings were not everyday events or impacted every black American family, the cultural impact carried forward can still be profound.
And yes, I am taking a devil's advocate position. In many cases such as those described in the OP and other comments here political correctness has been taken way, way to far. There is a difference between incitement and a listener's general uncomfort with subject matter. Especially in the context of a university there must be a free exchange of ideas and the ability to have discourse on any subject matter without fear of academic retribution or censorship.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#217I think the world would be better if, before you're allowed to respond to someone being wrong, you have to first be able to express their position in a way that they agree represents their view. Because 'political correctness' isn't the cancer at the heart of social politics, it is straw-manning. On both sides of every issue. I'd be surprised, perhaps even amazed, if Dr Piper had represented the complaint in any way…
Daniel Dennett refers to this as Rapoports rule. How to compose a successful critical commentary: You should attempt to re-express your target’s position so clearly, vividly, and fairly that your target says, “Thanks, I wish I’d thought of putting it that way. You should list any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement). You should mention anything you have learned f…
Dennett definitely has some experience with criticism and his opinion is worthwhile to listen to, so I agree with your addendum. Thanks for the link, I did not know this. However, Dennett and Rapoport list three further steps after re-expression.
2. You should list any points of agreement (especially if they are not matters of general or widespread agreement).
3. You should mention anything you have learned from your target.
4. Only then are you permitted to say so much as a word of rebuttal or criticism.
(I tried to follow the rules with my comment)
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
Actually white heterosexual middle class males can totally appreciate these things. Imagine what it is like to be white/asian in a country where a disproportionate number of crimes are committed by black men and where black on white crimes are 5.6 times more common than white on black crimes [1]. Imagine what it is like to be Christian when a disproportionate number of terror attacks are committed by Islamic types. M…
You just cited a blog which has this on their About Us page: "If whites permit themselves to become a minority population, they will lose their civilization, their heritage, and even their existence as a distinct people." Instead of allowing your father to fear for his and your safety based on his irrational and bigoted views, perhaps you could educate him not to accept data from fringe sources. Your reproduction of…
See my reply to EthanHeilman. Specifically, are you claiming the DOJ stats cited by this source are false, or that they made an arithmetic error when multiplying (# victims by race x) x (% of offenders of race Y)?
As for my father's feelings, it's really not cool to suggest he's bigoted. He's not - he's the epitome of a NY liberal and far more left wing than I am. E.g., he mostly accepts the tribalist fascism of the modern left, in comparison to my individualism. He's just unable to rationally assess the risk of low probability events that get lots of media coverage.
(He's hardly the only one. See, for example, this post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10655349 )
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#219I think the world would be better if, before you're allowed to respond to someone being wrong, you have to first be able to express their position in a way that they agree represents their view. Because 'political correctness' isn't the cancer at the heart of social politics, it is straw-manning. On both sides of every issue. I'd be surprised, perhaps even amazed, if Dr Piper had represented the complaint in any way…
A little research will produce a vast number of examples of political correctness with real consequences and not just "straw-manning". Here is a recent example: A Canadian university cancels a yoga class because yoga comes "from a culture that “experienced oppression, cultural genocide and diasporas due to colonialism and western supremacy,” In a world that can do that, I don't find it surprising that a student could…
You should post a source for the quote.
Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm asian. I don't feel threatened by black crime when it's also shown that police target black people for arrest more than whites and that the system is often stacked against black people. I'm more uncomfortable that white males are shooting up schools in my country several times a year because there's nothing being done pointing this demographic out. Your experience doesn't reflect the experience of all others.
Living in Asia, I've seen a lot more news about "white males shooting up schools" than I have about other violent crime in the US, except perhaps police brutality. It's on major news pages / channels. Admittedly, most of what I find is through social media (US and Chinese). Where do you get most your news?
Could be that one is more common than the other, therefore not as newsworthy. It's a sad state of affairs, but it seems most news is about sensationalism for purposes of generating revenue.