This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University • Hacker News Board

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#201

Post by jazzyk » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:54 PM UTC

maaku wrote: post #21

lagadu wrote: post #3

I find it baffling that there are people, in the real world, who somehow think that for unexplained reasons they have the right to not be offended or be made to feel uncomfortable. Somehow they believe that their feelings are the responsibility of everyone else.

While I sympathize with your viewpoint, perhaps I can shed some clarity on the other side. The concern is not feelings getting hurt, but rather physical security as a person of minority status. This is something that a white heterosexual middle-class male (such as myself) can probably never fully appreciate, but I try to sympathize. Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back yo…

As to women on campus, NCVS, the agency of the United States Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) reports around 0.4% rape rate, two orders of magnitude less from the numbers you quote (and if you look at the chart, decreasing over the past 20 years)

From Wikipedia:

A 2014 assessment by Sinozich and Langton used longitudinal data from the NCVS to measure rape and sexual assault among college aged U.S. women from 1995 to 2013. Their findings indicated that rape, a subset of all sexual assault, had an incidence of 1.4 per 1,000 female students (0.1%) in 2013[6] during the period studied. The study also found that college aged women (regardless of enrollment status) were assaulted at a significantly higher rate than non-college age women, 4.3 per 1,000 (0.4%) per year versus 1.4 per 1,000 (0.1%) per year, but that women who were not enrolled in college were 1.2 times more likely to be assaulted than college aged women who were enrolled.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campus_sexual_assault

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#202

Post by dnr » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:54 PM UTC

beedogs wrote: post #30

maaku wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I sympathize with your viewpoint, perhaps I can shed some clarity on the other side. The concern is not feelings getting hurt, but rather physical security as a person of minority status. This is something that a white heterosexual middle-class male (such as myself) can probably never fully appreciate, but I try to sympathize. Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back yo…

That's completely irrational, though. Since when has reading about a violent assault led to a violent assault?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copycat_crime

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_violence_research

Not to mention all the (I think justifiable) talk currently about how violent rhetoric from politicians, in the media, encouraged the planned parenthood shooter and other recent domestic terrorists.

I'm not completely sympathetic toward that point of view, but it's clearly not "completely irrational".

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#203

Post by kohanz » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:54 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #170

EthanHeilman wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linking to a post on the website of a White Supremacist organisation such as AmRen (American Renaissance) will probably hurt your argument more than help it. >Jared Taylor founded The New Century Foundation[0], a self-styled white supremacist think tank known primarily for American Renaissance, its online journal. The journal promotes pseudo-scientific studies that attempt to demonstrate the intellectual and cultural…

I don't understand - a white supremacist took a quantity from the DOJ, then took a percentage from the DOJ, and multiplied them together to get a new quantity. Does multiplication become invalid when a white supremacist does it? Or do DOJ stats become false when a racist cites them? Please, I would like to understand your logic. I do find it a bit scary that when I google "black on white crime", only racist sites sho…

You don't understand why when you google a complex topic such as "crime" and then apply a narrow, racial lens to it, mostly racist organizations show up? The term "X on Y crime" is suggesting that the relevant information about people who commit crimes and are victims of crime can be summarized by the color of their skin. That's as racist of a notion as it gets.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#204

Post by talmand » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:55 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #170

EthanHeilman wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linking to a post on the website of a White Supremacist organisation such as AmRen (American Renaissance) will probably hurt your argument more than help it. >Jared Taylor founded The New Century Foundation[0], a self-styled white supremacist think tank known primarily for American Renaissance, its online journal. The journal promotes pseudo-scientific studies that attempt to demonstrate the intellectual and cultural…

I don't understand - a white supremacist took a quantity from the DOJ, then took a percentage from the DOJ, and multiplied them together to get a new quantity. Does multiplication become invalid when a white supremacist does it? Or do DOJ stats become false when a racist cites them? Please, I would like to understand your logic. I do find it a bit scary that when I google "black on white crime", only racist sites sho…

It's a common tactic, attack the source of data to avoid discussing the data.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#205

Post by vixen99 » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:55 PM UTC

vdaniuk wrote: post #138

Juliate wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that people's feelings should come first (especially before truth/understanding of reality) is not uncomfortable, but a dangerous, misleading, childish posture. University is for adults, not toddlers.

>University is for adults, not toddlers. Oh really, so university students are able to consume alcohol, right? edit: noun: adult; - a person who is fully grown or developed. - a person who has reached the age of majority. edit 2: "Longitudinal neuroimaging studies demonstrate that the adolescent brain continues to mature well into the 20s. This has prompted intense interest in linking neuromaturation to maturity of j…

So what? University still remains a place for adults. All sorts of odd laws and regulations pertain to institutions and other organizations notwithstanding.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#206

Post by ceejayoz » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:55 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #170

EthanHeilman wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linking to a post on the website of a White Supremacist organisation such as AmRen (American Renaissance) will probably hurt your argument more than help it. >Jared Taylor founded The New Century Foundation[0], a self-styled white supremacist think tank known primarily for American Renaissance, its online journal. The journal promotes pseudo-scientific studies that attempt to demonstrate the intellectual and cultural…

I don't understand - a white supremacist took a quantity from the DOJ, then took a percentage from the DOJ, and multiplied them together to get a new quantity. Does multiplication become invalid when a white supremacist does it? Or do DOJ stats become false when a racist cites them? Please, I would like to understand your logic. I do find it a bit scary that when I google "black on white crime", only racist sites sho…

You can turn raw statistics into all sorts of false, misleading, or incomplete conclusions.

A white supremacist doing a statistical analysis isn't going to reach all that hard for stats that might contradict or weaken the conclusion they're trying for. If they find one accidentally, there's a pretty decent chance they'll "forget" to mention it.

I'm no expert in the field, but I'd wonder about things like encounter rates for the different populations, varying access to social services, things like lead paint being more prevalent in inner city housing, etc.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#207

Post by ebola1717 » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:56 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #170

EthanHeilman wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linking to a post on the website of a White Supremacist organisation such as AmRen (American Renaissance) will probably hurt your argument more than help it. >Jared Taylor founded The New Century Foundation[0], a self-styled white supremacist think tank known primarily for American Renaissance, its online journal. The journal promotes pseudo-scientific studies that attempt to demonstrate the intellectual and cultural…

I don't understand - a white supremacist took a quantity from the DOJ, then took a percentage from the DOJ, and multiplied them together to get a new quantity. Does multiplication become invalid when a white supremacist does it? Or do DOJ stats become false when a racist cites them? Please, I would like to understand your logic. I do find it a bit scary that when I google "black on white crime", only racist sites sho…

White on white crimes are 5x common than black on white crimes. It's obvious cherry-picking.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#208

Post by merpnderp » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:56 PM UTC

wpietri wrote: post #184

jbob2000 wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to add some more info; it was the student union that was running the yoga class and cancelled it, the university administration had no part in its cancellation. This was wholly done by students.

And honestly, I'm fine with that. Universities are for learning, and real learning comes from doing. The questions the students were grappling with are real ones. I expect they misapplied them here, as the yoga traditions I'm familiar with are mostly conscious Indian exports, their effort to share something with the world. But students should frequently get things wrong, because that's how real learning happens.

Learning only happens when there are consequences for being wrong. Aside from being ridiculed by people they disagree with and thus don't care about being ridiculed by, they have faced no consequences.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#209

Post by laotzu » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:57 PM UTC

The Gift of Insults, an old zen tale:

There once lived a great warrior. Though quite old, he still was able to defeat any challenger. His reputation extended far and wide throughout the land and many students gathered to study under him.One day an infamous young warrior arrived at the village. He was determined to be the first man to defeat the great master. Along with his strength, he had an uncanny ability to spot and exploit any weakness in an opponent. He would wait for his opponent to make the first move, thus revealing a weakness, and then would strike with merciless force and lightning speed. No one had ever lasted with him in a match beyond the first move.

Much against the advice of his concerned students, the old master gladly accepted the young warrior’s challenge. As the two squared off for battle, the young warrior began to hurl insults at the old master. He threw dirt and spit in his face. For hours he verbally assaulted him with every curse and insult known to mankind. But the old warrior merely stood there motionless and calm. Finally, the young warrior exhausted himself. Knowing he was defeated, he left feeling shamed.

Somewhat disappointed that he did not fight the insolent youth, the students gathered around the old master and questioned him. “How could you endure such an indignity? How did you drive him away?”

“If someone comes to give you a gift and you do not receive it,” the master replied, “to whom does the gift belong?”

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#210

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:57 PM UTC

wpietri wrote: post #184

jbob2000 wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to add some more info; it was the student union that was running the yoga class and cancelled it, the university administration had no part in its cancellation. This was wholly done by students.

And honestly, I'm fine with that. Universities are for learning, and real learning comes from doing. The questions the students were grappling with are real ones. I expect they misapplied them here, as the yoga traditions I'm familiar with are mostly conscious Indian exports, their effort to share something with the world. But students should frequently get things wrong, because that's how real learning happens.

[deleted]