Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer • Hacker News Board

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#401

Post by happycube » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 6:50 PM UTC

Zwi wrote: post #347

rockmeamedee wrote: post #333

This is great, but for people who want to "get started in computing", don't they also need a display, a mouse and a keyboard? LCD screens are like, $100, a mouse is $10-$20 new and low-end keyboards are $10-$30. At that combined price, why does it matter if the computer is $25 or $5? And if one is going to outlay the 150 bucks in peripherals, they might as well spend a bit more than $5 on the computer to get a signif…

Good point although remember that the (full size) Raspberry Pi has composite video output that can be used with the cheapest of TVs. IMO the Raspberry Pi Zero is more of a reaction to the C.H.I.P $9 computer on Kickstarter and not a cheap computer for people who cant afford a full size Pi.

There are pin headers on the zero for composite out - should be cheap+easy to bodge a jack, but it would pretty much weigh as much as the zero itself...

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#402

Post by dheera » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 6:53 PM UTC

maheart wrote: post #26

This is seriously impressive. While the Raspberry Pi is not the perfect hacker-friendly computer, it has done a lot of good. Some reasons off the top of my head: 1. Providing a low cost computer has given many people access to computers. Giving more people access to the web, email, an office suit, a programming environment AND giving people the ability of safely tinker without the fear of bricking an expensive device…

Definitely an impressive feat. I really, really, really wish it had on-board Wi-Fi though. At least that would make it a useful web server.

The way it's designed now, it's kind of unusable for anything useful without making it a 3X larger package. Add a Wi-Fi dongle and the converter from regular to micro-USB is about the size of the board itself. And since it only has 1 USB port, you'll need a full-blown hub to connect any other stuff like sensors, keyboards, or whatnot.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#403

Post by hueving » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 6:54 PM UTC

forinti wrote: post #266

pjc50 wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know Brazil has prohibitive import duties on electronics, does this also apply to Chile?

But books, magazines, etc. don't pay taxes. That's why this free Rpi with MagPi #40 is awesome: you don't have to pay taxes at all.

Tax is not just based on the price. If the fact that you were getting it for free were good enough to avoid import taxes, everyone would just have friends in other countries send them 'gifts'.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#404

Post by teraflop » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 6:58 PM UTC

facepalm wrote: post #287

What I would like to know more about is how to power these gadgets. Say I want a sensor that sends data to a server. Do I need to plug it into a power outlet? Can I run it off a battery for a significant amount of time (months)? Can I use solar power? How much power does WiFi consume, or should I look into Bluetooth or ZigBee?

> Can I run it off a battery for a significant amount of time (months)?

Depends on how big a battery you're willing to use. In the other thread, someone claimed that the Pi Zero's typical power consumption is about 0.8 watts, so running it for a month would require about 600 watt-hours. That's roughly the energy content of one car battery, or ten Macbook batteries, or about 230 alkaline AAs. A USB wifi adapter would probably add another 0.5-1.0W.

The Raspberry Pi isn't a great option for this kind of long-term low-power application, because it doesn't really have any power management capabilities to speak of. If you can get by with a low duty cycle, you could use additional components to wake up the Pi only when necessary. Less-powerful microcontrollers are more likely to have this functionality built in; for example, TI's Tiva series of ARM Cortex-M4F chips have a "hibernate" mode in which they can draw as little as 5 microwatts.

> Can I use solar power?

Again, it depends. A solar panel that can provide ~1W is not very large or expensive, but that's the rated output under direct sunlight. The actual power available could easily be 10x lower if it's cloudy, or 100x lower under very bright indoor lighting. And presumably you'll still want a battery and charging circuitry to keep things running at light or in low light. It's certainly doable, but the power supply will end up costing a lot more than the Pi itself.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#405

Post by tejtm » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 6:59 PM UTC

tibbon wrote: post #395

teh_klev wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol...I'm the same. I have four of the sodding things (Pi#1-B, revised Pi#1-B and two of the model 2 B's) complete with PSU's...all sitting in a box. So many plans, so little time.

I wonder if the problem for most of us isn't the money, but just the time. A cheap computer probably doesn't give us any more time/ease than an expensive computer (which we probably already have 1+ of)

Find a local makerspace and pop in every once in a while. A bit of time spent with others doing things rubs off.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#406

Post by franciscop » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 7:02 PM UTC

dheera wrote: post #402

maheart wrote: post #26

This is seriously impressive. While the Raspberry Pi is not the perfect hacker-friendly computer, it has done a lot of good. Some reasons off the top of my head: 1. Providing a low cost computer has given many people access to computers. Giving more people access to the web, email, an office suit, a programming environment AND giving people the ability of safely tinker without the fear of bricking an expensive device…

Definitely an impressive feat. I really, really, really wish it had on-board Wi-Fi though. At least that would make it a useful web server. The way it's designed now, it's kind of unusable for anything useful without making it a 3X larger package. Add a Wi-Fi dongle and the converter from regular to micro-USB is about the size of the board itself. And since it only has 1 USB port, you'll need a full-blown hub to conn…

For one I'm glad it doesn't have wifi since that'd add on size and cost. I hope that the ecosystem takes off and shields get created like wifi, bluetooth, gsm, etc. That would be really useful and give everyone flexibility.

From the differences amongst the Arduino, I see the hdmi as a necessary evil. Otherwise it'd be too cumbersome to debug.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#407

Post by Asmod4n » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 7:05 PM UTC

ac29 wrote: post #344

Asmod4n wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only modern distro it runs is Raspbian. Ubuntu and Kali don't run on it let alone Windows 10 IoT core, same goes for Arch and pretty much everything else. This is a ARMv6, for which most distros stopped support several years ago if they ever ran on it.

Arch will definitely run on a Pi: http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv6/raspberry-pi So will Win10 IOT core, Ubuntu, and several other things: https://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/

Win10 IOT core needs ARMv7. The latest Ubuntu with ARMv6 support was karmic (9.10) Forgot about arch Supporting ARMv6.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#408

Post by geographomics » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 7:05 PM UTC

malandrew wrote: post #371

I would love to see someone sell these as preconfigured as minimal bandwidth tor exit nodes with wifi so they can be spread far and wide. Just connect to power, make sure it is connected to a wifi network and then leave it alone. Just make sure it advertises itself as such so that law enforcement knows that it is likely not owned by the owner of the Internet connection and therefore doesn't make sense to do anything…

Most wifi networks are NATed, so this would only work if you could also reconfigure the router to forward the necessary ports to the device.

You could use it more easily for hosting hidden services though, as those only require an outbound connection to be made to the Tor network. Hidden services on a hidden device.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#409

Post by driverdan » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 7:09 PM UTC

malandrew wrote: post #371

I would love to see someone sell these as preconfigured as minimal bandwidth tor exit nodes with wifi so they can be spread far and wide. Just connect to power, make sure it is connected to a wifi network and then leave it alone. Just make sure it advertises itself as such so that law enforcement knows that it is likely not owned by the owner of the Internet connection and therefore doesn't make sense to do anything…

These are not well suited for Tor. No built in networking and a serious lack of CPU power needed for processing encryption.

Re: Raspberry Pi Zero: the $5 computer

#410

Post by traverseda » Thu, Nov 26, 2015, 7:10 PM UTC

geographomics wrote: post #408

malandrew wrote: post #371

I would love to see someone sell these as preconfigured as minimal bandwidth tor exit nodes with wifi so they can be spread far and wide. Just connect to power, make sure it is connected to a wifi network and then leave it alone. Just make sure it advertises itself as such so that law enforcement knows that it is likely not owned by the owner of the Internet connection and therefore doesn't make sense to do anything…

Most wifi networks are NATed, so this would only work if you could also reconfigure the router to forward the necessary ports to the device. You could use it more easily for hosting hidden services though, as those only require an outbound connection to be made to the Tor network. Hidden services on a hidden device.

upnp is a thing at least some of the time.