Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter • Hacker News Board

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#141

Post by nostromo » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 8:48 PM UTC

Bud wrote: post #122

throwaway420 wrote: post #30

Despite the visual appeal of their products, Apple normally does a very good job with prioritizing function over form except in this case with the charger wire being so fragile and thin. I know I'm not the most careful and delicate person in the world, but the failure rate here is ridiculous compared to other similar products I own. The end of the cable gets frayed every single time. Otherwise, Apple makes ridiculous…

I support around 300 Macs for work. In my extensive experience, the deal here is that people are FAR too rough and careless in winding up those charger cables over and over. Apple HAS implemented strain relief here and done their best to make the points of failure less vulnerable. Here's a tip: Instead of yanking the cable at a 90-degree angle and winding as tightly as possible, let the cable come out of the charger…

My earphones kept breaking (I use them while working out) so I reinforced the sensitive area with a heat-shrink wire wrap, like these:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008WWC6FU

It works wonders. I'm not sure this would work for Mac chargers because you couldn't get the sleeve over the ends, but it also works iPhone charger cables.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#142

Post by engi_nerd » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 8:49 PM UTC

Bud wrote: post #122

throwaway420 wrote: post #30

Despite the visual appeal of their products, Apple normally does a very good job with prioritizing function over form except in this case with the charger wire being so fragile and thin. I know I'm not the most careful and delicate person in the world, but the failure rate here is ridiculous compared to other similar products I own. The end of the cable gets frayed every single time. Otherwise, Apple makes ridiculous…

I support around 300 Macs for work. In my extensive experience, the deal here is that people are FAR too rough and careless in winding up those charger cables over and over. Apple HAS implemented strain relief here and done their best to make the points of failure less vulnerable. Here's a tip: Instead of yanking the cable at a 90-degree angle and winding as tightly as possible, let the cable come out of the charger…

Yup, I always followed your exact advice and still wound up with frayed and ultimately broken cables within 10 months or so.

It's always possible that I just have bad luck. That doesn't mean I dislike your advice though.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#143

Post by mrmondo » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 8:54 PM UTC

jegutman wrote: post #113

mrmondo wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm one of those annoying people that has never had MacBook charger perish or fray, until very recently I still had a 2011 MBP and its original charger was fine. But yes I've seen people with dangerously broken chargers before, I have noticed they're often people with cracked phone screens - I wonder if they're perhaps people that are either more physically active with their hardware or perhaps more careless with loo…

I have a cat. None of my other charging cables are vulnerable except my macbook pro one. I've already lost two! Even if they made it easier to replace just the cable that goes from the adapter to the macbook it would be a big win for me.

Have you tried spraying the cable with a feline repellant? I find they work quite well to stop indoor urination.

Edit: also try wiping the table with eucaliptis oil as they often don't like the smell on their paws / mouth.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#144

Post by grandalf » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:00 PM UTC

While it's clear that Apple attempts to limit the production of junk peripherals by patenting its connectors, it would be great if licenses were made readily available to companies wishing to make high quality stuff.

Even just putting a magsafe connector on the brick itself would allow the cable to be easily replaced if it frayed.

Does anyone know if Apple laptops contain enough protective circuitry to be used safely with inferior power adapters? It appears that some of that sophistication is actually just moving parts out of the laptop and into the adapter.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#145

Post by mng2 » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:03 PM UTC

listic wrote: post #101

austenallred wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>On eBay >say genuine Having been an eBay buyer/seller for a long time, I would put way less stock in someone on eBay saying a product is "genuine" than you appear to be.

I've been buying some ThinkPad chargers on eBay and never encountered outright fraud. When they say genuine , they really are. Otherwise they use different words.

I wouldn't be so trusting. In the best case they are real, or ghost shift production. In the worst case they are fakes that have all the safety features cut out. There's no way to know unless you open them up.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#146

Post by vonklaus » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:03 PM UTC

weland wrote: post #20

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may not quite be true, but it's not necessarily a lie. People often don't realise where an invention came from.

It's more likely a bold overstatement made by a superficial onlooker. Wozniak describes the same power supply here: http://archive.woz.org/letters/general/35.html , in these terms: Other hobby computers of the day used inefficient power supplies. The Apple ][ was the first computer ever to use a plastic case. The heat buildup using even my own power supply design (inefficient type) would have been too great. Steve ta…

interesting. i was thinking about that quote before reading the article, and did not realize it was incorrect.

how inportant was/is a switching supply, and was incorporating it really as simple as copying a well-known design?

also, i think that in this case Job's has to characterized as ignorant or a liar.

he almost had no idea how power supplies work and this "invention" gave him the ability to credit someone other than woz for the Apple II success. which is how i read this qoute, as jobs usually didn't publicly praise people without a motive.

or.

he did realize how this work and lied to rewrite the books on what company made this contribution. i think it was a bit of both, but the ignorance allows one to attribute some of the mischarachterizations to lack of info rather than simple disingenuousness.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#147

Post by rdancer » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:06 PM UTC

s73v3r wrote: post #118

XorNot wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is the market at the moment is terrible. When buy genuine Apple or Samsung you know the quality is good. But when you pay something closer to what it should cost, who knows what you're getting? Could be a decent charger, could be heavily marked up Chinese junk.

Wouldn't the fact that the lower priced stuff is usually junk indicate that what it "should" cost is closer to what Apple charges?

It indicates that both the governments and the industry have dropped the ball on enforcing the law against small companies. When you look at what this guy is doing with the Apple-compatible power supplies and cables, or the Google reviews of USB-C cables on Amazon, it shows the sorry state we're in.

One of the major advantages of EU/US markets is that laws are enforced. This allows you to compete on fair terms. In theory, the products should be recalled, the companies that import them fined, and their principals either fined, barred from directing a company, or criminally prosecuted. But does that ever happen? When laws are not enforced, law-breakers will be able to undercut you, and drive you from the market. Which is exactly what has happened here.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#148

Post by jegutman » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:08 PM UTC

mrmondo wrote: post #143

jegutman wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a cat. None of my other charging cables are vulnerable except my macbook pro one. I've already lost two! Even if they made it easier to replace just the cable that goes from the adapter to the macbook it would be a big win for me.

Have you tried spraying the cable with a feline repellant? I find they work quite well to stop indoor urination. Edit: also try wiping the table with eucaliptis oil as they often don't like the smell on their paws / mouth.

No problem with urination, just pawing / chewing. I should try the eucalyptus oil.

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#149

Post by tmd83 » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:09 PM UTC

mikepurvis wrote: post #12

Analemma_ wrote: post #2

My takeaway from this is that the $80 Apple charger is definitely safer and has higher-quality components than the $12 cheapo Chinese charger, but not nearly so much better that it solely explains the price difference, and that Apple is making a healthy margin on these things. So my question is, is anyone selling a quality charger without the Apple tax? Is there anyone making, say, $40 chargers that have the componen…

I doubt it, since the magnetic connector itself is patented, and they apparently don't license it— which is why the BatteryBox connector is such an awkward hack: https://www.getbatterybox.com/shop

I have been curious since I saw this. Does batterybox really works? And if it does then why aren't any big player licensing the tech.

How can it bypass the charging and directly power the laptop using the same connector?

Re: Macbook charger teardown: surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter

#150

Post by vacri » Wed, Nov 25, 2015, 9:09 PM UTC

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #71

jacquesm wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 'Original Apple' item shown at the bottom of the post doesn't look as if it fared much better though. The magic smoke definitely came out on that one and whoever owned it was lucky it ended there and didn't end with an actual fire.

Apple's own charger follows safety standards. It might blow up, but it won't take your laptop with it.

Upthread there is someone saying that their Apple charger set fire to their carpet, and the only reason why it wasn't worse was because they were in the room at the time to stop it.