Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted • Hacker News Board

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#331

Post by gohrt » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 1:55 AM UTC

automathematics wrote: post #315

eli wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My bank deposits are FDIC insured

Worth mentioning, Coinbase has some kind of insurance: https://support.coinbase.com/customer/portal/articles/166237...

That's Coinbase's insurance. That's not coinbase customers' indurance. FDIC is _my_ insurance coverage.

> Coinbase is insured against employee theft and hacking in an amount that exceeds the average value of online bitcoin it holds at any given time.

If someone steals 90% of Coinbase's transiently held coins, no insurance coverage.

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#332

Post by gohrt » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 1:58 AM UTC

xkiwi wrote: post #320

giancarlostoro wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's really odd about this (to me at least) is I've never had such an experience from any of my real banks.

Real banks will ask you for Driver Licenses and SSN when you open a bank account with them. Information on DL has your height, eye color, address, telephone number, your photo, your finger prints. That's why they don't need to ask for your income again. However, I tried Coinbase and will not use them ever again.

fingerprints on DL?

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#333

Post by gohrt » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 2:02 AM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #286

mirimir wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have civil asset forfeiture to handle that ;)

Indeed. USPS money orders are pretty good for getting around that. They can be cashed at any USPS facility, can be bought in $1K limits (no more than $3K per day though), and can essentially be treated as bearer bonds if you don't fill them out until time of exchange.

Why is that safer? Cops can seize cars; why can't they seize money orders?

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#334

Post by cdubzzz » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 2:25 AM UTC

gohrt wrote: post #332

xkiwi wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real banks will ask you for Driver Licenses and SSN when you open a bank account with them. Information on DL has your height, eye color, address, telephone number, your photo, your finger prints. That's why they don't need to ask for your income again. However, I tried Coinbase and will not use them ever again.

fingerprints on DL?

I guess they are likely to be on the card? Haha. Also phone number. Does any state DL actually have that?

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#335

Post by clolege » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 2:57 AM UTC

largehotcoffee wrote: post #285

I cannot recommend Coinbase at all. I operate an adult comic book publisher and they shutdown our account without notice and gave no real reason for their action. All support tickets took 3 - 5 days to get a reply and it was always unhelpful. For a company like ours the whole appeal of Bitcoin is the anonymity, so our readers don't have to worry about buying lewd comics and having it show up on their statements. Coin…

I've had the same exact experience. They locked my account for weeks without response to my emails, and when they finally get back to me they told me that I'm "ineligible to use their service" but without ever a reason why.

The entire ordeal was really frustrating and I would strongly recommend against their service also.

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#336

Post by eco » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 3:47 AM UTC

largehotcoffee wrote: post #285

I cannot recommend Coinbase at all. I operate an adult comic book publisher and they shutdown our account without notice and gave no real reason for their action. All support tickets took 3 - 5 days to get a reply and it was always unhelpful. For a company like ours the whole appeal of Bitcoin is the anonymity, so our readers don't have to worry about buying lewd comics and having it show up on their statements. Coin…

Sounds like Bitcoin may have finally gotten its PayPal.

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#337

Post by aianus » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 3:51 AM UTC

spilk wrote: post #236

aianus wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's silly, that's like saying you don't have USD if all you have is a USD-denominated deposit checking account at a bank.

That's absolutely true, though. You are trusting the bank (and the federal insurance backing it) that when you want to draw your balance that you can. It's no different when you have bitcoin in Coinbase. I just can't see a scenario where buying bitcoin with USD on Coinbase and then using a debit card to spend it in USD is better than spending USD in the first place. Unless you buy into the pyramid-scheme "it'll be $1…

99.9% of people would disagree with you that the balance they see in their Wells Fargo account is 'not actually USD'. In a way Coinbase BTC is closer to BTC than Wells Fargo USD is to USD because Coinbase doesn't operate a fractional reserve.

> I just can't see a scenario where buying bitcoin with USD on Coinbase and then using a debit card to spend it in USD is better than spending USD in the first place.

Sure, that would be silly. But imagine you're a rich Chinese kid in California whose parents own a sweatshop in Shenzhen. To easily get around capital controls they buy BTC in China and send it to your Coinbase account. You pay for your day-to-day USD expenses on this card. Use your imagination.

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#338

Post by aianus » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 4:01 AM UTC

Symbiote wrote: post #244

Pfhreak wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious if this could also be used to help with remittances. I have several friends who emigrated from countries around the world, and they struggle to find an easy way to remit to their parents. Bitcoin seems so close, but it's difficult for their folks to get it converted to local currency. The fees and hurdles they currently deal with are outrageous, and while it looks like the shift card is US only, it seems…

Since emigrating this summer, I've transferred about £25k ($40k) using TransferWise and been very pleased with the way the service works. I paid far less in fees than any other service I could find a quote for. I was concerned that being in a small European country with its own currency would mean payments took longer, but this wasn't the case. They're based in the UK, and properly regulated by both the UK and US. Yo…

Seems to cost ~1% which is better than banks but still $400(!) on $40k. I use Bitcoin to transfer money from USD to THB and get better than spot if I time it right.

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#339

Post by lobster_johnson » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 4:01 AM UTC

Symbiote wrote: post #235

IkmoIkmo wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well no you're not really using bitcoin, not even Coinbase bitcoin. At the end of the day the creditcard simply uses a normal credit card transaction, which is denominated in dollars and paid for by Coinbase, in dollars, to the merchant. All Coinbase does is 1) make sure you enough bitcoin to cover the transaction 2) sell your bitcoin to recoup the dollars they're paying on your behalf to the merchant None of this ha…

> creditcards are basically plastic sheets of text Looking again at the site, there's no chip on the card. I thought the USA had finally introduced these — did I misunderstand something? (All my cards have had chips for over 10 years.)

Yes, they are coming. I received my chip card replacements recently. The reason they are finally doing it is because of the so-called EVM fraud liability shift [1], which changes who will be held responsible for card fraud.

[1] http://www.paymentsleader.com/will-retailers-be-ready-for-em...

Re: Introducing the Shift Card: Use Bitcoin where Visa is accepted

#340

Post by kobayashi » Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 4:29 AM UTC

trevelyan wrote: post #40

kobayashi wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost equally bad.

Perhaps we can quash the notion that financial privacy is "bad". Anyone who deals with international finance knows that KYC compliance is a joke and the required submission of sensitive personal documents to third-party companies is a major contributor to identity theft and fraud. Indeed, identity fraud is in many ways a product of policies that force companies to collect this data. Nor is there any sensible moral ar…

I don't think it's equally bad because people should be anonymous when banking with bitcoin. I meant that wildly different application of rules is the bad thing.

More importantly, if a business has rules meant for financial security, compliance is important. An organization that institutionalizes non-compliance as a norm is seriously problematic.