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Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

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Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#31

Post by jbob2000 »

on_and_off wrote: post #22
jbob2000 wrote: post #11

Would it have been cheaper to pay the top 100 Android apps to make a Windows version? Perhaps they do it on a continual basis to keep their marketplace up to date? On that note, I'd like to try making a windows phone app. Is there anything sorely missing from the platform?

AFAIK, they already do that. >Is there anything sorely missing from the platform? without trolling : the users. It is possible to have some success on the windows mobile platform, but there just isn't a critical mass of users. Other than that, even though it has its problems (like Android or iOS), it has most of the things you would expect.

I'm OK with low users. It's impossible to capture users on iOS and Android because the marketplace is so huge; I can't build anything which doesn't already have 10 different versions. The prospect of a "new frontier" is exciting to me, even if the frontier is very small.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#33

Post by frik »

seibelj wrote: post #18

As someone who has spent years building software on top of compiled android binaries, as in, adding features to apps with nothing more than the APK (no source code), I can say that what they are building is not only difficult but quite fragile. I have the benefit of customers who agree to certain OS versions and specific app versions. MS wants it to work universally with every app. It's possible to get it close enoug…

Possible, but it's a usual Microsoft tactics to announce a product years in advance and never deliver (vamporware).

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#34

Post by bkjelden »

jbob2000 wrote: post #11

Would it have been cheaper to pay the top 100 Android apps to make a Windows version? Perhaps they do it on a continual basis to keep their marketplace up to date? On that note, I'd like to try making a windows phone app. Is there anything sorely missing from the platform?

The problem with apps when I left WP wasn't necessarily #1-50, it was #51-500. They had most of the top 50 (with a couple glaring holes, but those didn't impact me personally).

The problem was that "apps" have become the default mobile delivery platform for a lot of things that should be websites, and the creators of those apps always target two platforms: Android and iOS.

So you were just continually left out of the party.

Pizza chain has a mobile app for online ordering? Not on WP.

Smaller-scale sports network or league has a streaming app? Not on WP.

Niche social network? Not on WP.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#35

Post by Zigurd »

andridk wrote: post #19

Jolla achieved this. My Jolla phone can run most Android apps without problems. Maybe Microsoft's scope was too big?

That is basically correct. My understanding is that Jolla phones run an Android runtime, either Dalvik VM or ART, plus the Android Framework code.

Had Microsoft taken the approach of running a separate runtime for Android apps instead of trying to map frameworks, they might have something by now.

They would still have to map the semantics of the behavior of an app being foreground or not, connect the clipboard, etc. So it's not like dropping-in a runtime that's meant to be portable, but it's a lot closer.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#36

Post by Zigurd »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #28

A good reason why google play services exists is to stop things like this. Its a complex moving target that gets updated monthly. Sure, you can do this with apps that don't use play services, but a lot do, especially popular ones. MS would have a hard time keeping up with changes. Blackberry tried this and it didn't save the Blackberry product. They pretty much gave up recently and now have an excellent android phone…

Amazon does without Google Play Services, and app developers are able to publish their apps on Amazon. It's not a very high bar for app developers, and moving to a Microsoft runtime would be little different than being portable across Google and Amazon devices.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#37

Post by tkinom »

There is another potential approach.

I used to run Ubuntu for ARM on the same development phone/tablet as Android for the sole reason that I can use the Ubuntu/debian tools to debug some Android OS related issue.

It is very easy to setup with chroot.

MS can probably get linux kernel VM running inside WM ARM cpu. With that, one can probably quickly run Ubuntu or Android unmodified on WM.

Pro: probably just work. Google did most of the works already. Android VM runs in x86 Windows/Linux today.

Con: Might need more memory. 2+GB for MVP. Not a low end phone anymore

Not sure why MS doesn't start with this approach and extend from that.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#38

Post by Zigurd »

Jolla, Blackberry, and Tizen (did that one ever get shipped?) have Android runtime ports that can run many Android apps really well. Not surprising because the apps are touching the same bits they touch in "real" Android. But that hasn't made a lot of difference to the popularity of those OSs. App users who want Android apps are unlikely to want an OS other than Android. Windows probably had the strongest case for using Android compatibility effectively. I can think of plausible cases where a customer needs to use Windows but wants Android apps.

Here is my prediction for what comes next: Microdroid, an OS that, like Fire OS, is based on AOSP, but uses the Microsoft ecosystem. That will happen because the ecosystem and apps are more important than the OS.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#39

Post by rtl49 »

I understand Microsoft's business interest in entering this space, but at this point there seems to be quite little incentive for consumers to switch from Apple and Android phones.

The success of this project seemed dubious for several reasons, not the least of which is the dependence of so many apps on specific functionality of the Google Play Services API, which is subject to change. But even if Windows phones could run all Android apps perfectly, this only solves the issue of Android's entrenchment. What feature could a Windows phone offer that competing phones do not? There is the questionable justification of "integration" with Microsoft's desktop offerings, but honestly much of this functionality is already available. If there is some great boon to this that justifies the cost of the switch for users, it isn't obvious.

Re: Microsoft's plan to port Android apps to Windows proves too complex

#40

Post by rasz_pl »

bingobob wrote: post #4
stevep2007 wrote: post #2

The Astoria project at Microsoft failed because a breakthrough was needed to overcome the complexity of the software development challenge. Microsoft tried to automate mapping the Android UI into the Windows 10 UI and to map Google services within the app such as maps, payments and notifications into Microsoft equivalents. Automated conversion of a UI from one platform to another has never been successfully demonstra…

Google Play Services are also updated every few month, Microsoft would always behind the eightball when trying to remap services. but what is truly impressive from Microsoft is there Xbox 360 Emulation on the Xbox One go check it out you will be surprised

for truly impressive look up Bleemcast!, Playstation emulator running on Dreamcast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-tQX-XZhX0

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