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Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

nytimes.com

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Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#31

Post by robotkilla »

robotkilla wrote: post #8
staunch wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

James Clapper's congressional perjury will probably make the history books as an example of modern corruption. For a crime committed against the very core of American democracy, the press gave him a pass and the president gave him a promotion. Maybe he blackmailed everyone using NSA data... http://www.hasjamesclapperbeenindictedyet.com/

Clapper didn't get punished because he did his job. Lying and spying is what he's been paid and ordered to do. If he didn't commit perjury my guess is that he would have been disappeared. I'm not arguing for him or the system but I'm not at all shocked that it was swept under the rug.

And there are the reddit style down votes as expected...

For the record I'm not saying clapper was in the right or that he shouldn't face charges, but in a country where sanctioned torture is the norm why should unpunished perjury by an official from a spy agency be shocking?

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#33

Post by verbin217 »

verbin217 wrote: post #15
justcommenting wrote: post #12

The world is a better place because Edward Snowden helped create an enabling environment for transparency, accountability, and civil society monitoring of programs that make the world less safe and less free. Perhaps even more importantly, I hope this public ruling will make it more difficult for any of us to tell our grandchildren that we didn't know [0] about serious things going seriously wrong. 0. e.g. "And, at t…

Well... As the guy that did all of that let me tell you: it's futile. I knew back when Bill Binney came forward. It was all documented or otherwise obvious. From this I've learned something. People are HEAVILY biased towards the version of the "truth" that lets them do what they want. Like whatever they were doing before you started talking about this shit. lol. The WANT comes first for them. Then when you complain a…

Damn it! I just read this 10 hours later. I totally know how to spell "hemorrhage". Don't judge me posterity.

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#34

Post by caligastia »

junto wrote: post #30
tempodox wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe he blackmailed everyone using NSA data Even if he didn't, it's only a question of time until the NSA starts blackmailing everyone with NSA data.

I'm not American, so your politics are largely irrelevant to me, but as an American I would find it probably worth looking at Obama's stance on bulk surveillance over time. Has he flip-flopped? If so, either he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness in preventing terrorist attacks on the US, or maybe he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness after being shown his last 10 years of internet searches, pr…

If you live on Planet Earth, American politics are relevant to you, as distasteful as that thought might be.

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#35

Post by staunch »

junto wrote: post #30
tempodox wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe he blackmailed everyone using NSA data Even if he didn't, it's only a question of time until the NSA starts blackmailing everyone with NSA data.

I'm not American, so your politics are largely irrelevant to me, but as an American I would find it probably worth looking at Obama's stance on bulk surveillance over time. Has he flip-flopped? If so, either he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness in preventing terrorist attacks on the US, or maybe he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness after being shown his last 10 years of internet searches, pr…

He doesn't want a serious attack to happen on his watch. There's a strong incentive to do "everything possible" to prevent one. Very few people would reward him for reigning in his own power, but nearly everyone will blame if an attack happens.

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#36

Post by jacquesm »

Nadya wrote: post #7
jacquesm wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that to date nobody has been held responsible lends a great deal of credibility to your conspiracy theory. I'd be highly surprised if they were upset at what they did, I think they're mostly upset at being caught.

>The fact that to date nobody has been held responsible lends a great deal of credibility to your conspiracy theory. Do you mind explaining why you think that? I do not think it makes my theory any more credible. My concern is that checks and balances rely on oversight. Oversight relies on motivation. There doesn't seem to be any motivation to provide oversight of the NSA. Anyone in a position to provide oversight ca…

Sad to see your comment downvoted, its not fair when you get hammered like that on a follow up question on your own comment. Bleh.

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#37

Post by Nadya »

jacquesm wrote: post #36
Nadya wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The fact that to date nobody has been held responsible lends a great deal of credibility to your conspiracy theory. Do you mind explaining why you think that? I do not think it makes my theory any more credible. My concern is that checks and balances rely on oversight. Oversight relies on motivation. There doesn't seem to be any motivation to provide oversight of the NSA. Anyone in a position to provide oversight ca…

Sad to see your comment downvoted, its not fair when you get hammered like that on a follow up question on your own comment. Bleh.

It's most likely due to my last paragraph and not the follow up question itself. :) Don't worry about it.

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#38

Post by verbin217 »

SamReidHughes wrote: post #21
verbin217 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "... I could perhaps have tried to find out about things." I meant that . > Wait what? you're Snwoden? Not that .

It was very polite of the parent to misspell it Snwoden to give you room to make a truthful denial.

I meant the former. It's truthful even if spelled correctly. ;)

Re: Judge Deals a Blow to N.S.A. Data Collection Program

#39

Post by glitchdout »

junto wrote: post #30
tempodox wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe he blackmailed everyone using NSA data Even if he didn't, it's only a question of time until the NSA starts blackmailing everyone with NSA data.

I'm not American, so your politics are largely irrelevant to me, but as an American I would find it probably worth looking at Obama's stance on bulk surveillance over time. Has he flip-flopped? If so, either he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness in preventing terrorist attacks on the US, or maybe he was persuaded by evidence of its effectiveness after being shown his last 10 years of internet searches, pr…

> Has he flip-flopped?

Well... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BmdovYztH8

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