Interview by a 15 Year Old • Hacker News Board

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#21

Post by eropple » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 5:57 PM UTC

notahacker wrote: post #11

vdaniuk wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I think programming is just one of many skills that one can master, not a must-have skill. Programming/coding/software engineer is, probably, the only skill that provides high income opportunities, freedom to relocate, a global market and low financial cost of entry. Unless a kid is coming from a rich family, learning programming among other skills is her/his best bet at achieving a decent quality of life. Also, say…

Most white collar professions in the developed world offer high income opportunities, freedom to relocate, global markets and low financial cost of entry without having high-school level programming skill or wealthy parents as a baseline requirement.

Many (not all, of course) of them do require significantly more up-front investment, though. Not disagreeing with you, but there are complicating factors.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#22

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:01 PM UTC

myth_buster wrote: post #19

Is there anything else that isn’t taught to young students that you wish would be incorporated into the material, or any other thoughts on education? I can't comment on the US education system, but back home I think one of the most important ingredient missing from my school education was _Critical Thinking_ [0]. I happened to stumble upon this field by happenstance and was baffled why this is not integral to our edu…

[deleted]

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#23

Post by Amorymeltzer » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:03 PM UTC

I'd like to just say thanks to Paul for doing this, it was probably hugely meaningful to the kid. Ages ago I interviewed Neil deGrasse Tyson for an 8th grade assignment - it is still one of the best moments of my life, and one of the major reasons I am a scientist now.

I recently read Judd Apatow's book "Sick in the Head", wherein he interviews comedians, beginning in high school. Looking back, I wish I'd contacted more of my heroes. There's very real meaning that comes from it, even just to humanize people a teenager looks up to. I'd love to see more of this.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#24

Post by JoshTriplett » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:13 PM UTC

kercker wrote: post #2

"I think all kids should learn how to program at some point. I'm not sure what's the right age." I do not think all kids should learn how to program. I think programming is just one of many skills that one can master, not a must-have skill.

At one time, not everyone automatically agreed that everyone should learn to type, or learn basic computer literacy. Or to look back even further in history, at one point not everyone could read and write.

Imagine if we could expect a basic level of programming skill from everyone. Not the ability to write an operating system kernel from scratch; just the ability needed to put together a shell pipeline to get a job done, or a twenty-line script to automate some tedious task. Imagine how much that would change everyday life.

How would mass-market applications change if a tiny bit of scripting skill wasn't too much to ask? How would people's behavior change if their first reaction to any kind of tedious task was "I should automate this", and sometimes they actually could? How would public policy (especially on technology) change?

We're moving towards a future run heavily by computers; raising the baseline level of understanding seems critical to me, and it doesn't seem like too much to ask.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#25

Post by sacado2 » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:19 PM UTC

moonchrome wrote: post #9

kozukumi wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even then I don't really see the point. If you want to teach kids problem solving skills, logic, breaking down a problem, etc. then that makes much more sense as it is applicable in many areas of life but spending an hour a week for several months teaching a kid how to make a little game in Python isn't really going to benefit them at all in the long run in my opinion.

>If you want to teach kids problem solving skills, logic, breaking down a problem, etc. then that makes much more sense as it is applicable in many areas of life but spending an hour a week for several months teaching a kid how to make a little game in Python isn't really going to benefit them at all in the long run in my opinion. I'm willing to bet it will do more good for 90% of them than learning about Chemical Bo…

This. Plus, it has the virtue of teaching you logic and rational thinking, which is something useful in every field of life, not only programing.

Plus it makes computers less frightening and magical since you have a bit of understanding of how they work.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#26

Post by pcote » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:21 PM UTC

SRasch wrote: post #16

"The combination of forces that produced the default curriculum was so random" This seems true and sad. What would be a first principles approach to "What should every kid learn" if we were to start from scratch you think?

If we were to start from scratch? Every kid should learn to be themselves. Let their individual educations naturally sprout forth from that.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#27

Post by dominotw » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:22 PM UTC

SRasch wrote: post #16

"The combination of forces that produced the default curriculum was so random" This seems true and sad. What would be a first principles approach to "What should every kid learn" if we were to start from scratch you think?

> "What should every kid learn" if we were to start from scratch you think?

Depends on socio economic class I would imagine. If you belong to middle class in India for example, you would want you kids to buy into 'the cult of achievement' where achievement is defined by how many people you can prove that you are better than. Because this is only one of the few methods available to Indian middle class to ensure that her child is not going to live a life of destitution. You probably won't care if your child is 'thinking critically'.

But I guess it is an interesting question as to what school would mean if you belong to upper class in America where you are free from social morality and hierarchies. I would imagine you want you child to learn how to be passionate about things so they can escape a life of constant boredom.

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#28

Post by DanBC » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:23 PM UTC

JoshTriplett wrote: post #24

kercker wrote: post #2

"I think all kids should learn how to program at some point. I'm not sure what's the right age." I do not think all kids should learn how to program. I think programming is just one of many skills that one can master, not a must-have skill.

At one time, not everyone automatically agreed that everyone should learn to type, or learn basic computer literacy. Or to look back even further in history, at one point not everyone could read and write. Imagine if we could expect a basic level of programming skill from everyone. Not the ability to write an operating system kernel from scratch; just the ability needed to put together a shell pipeline to get a job d…

> Or to look back even further in history, at one point not everyone could read and write.

We still have that, in 1st world countries. (I've used the wikipedia entry for the US, but rates are similar across EU)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_the_United_States

> This government study showed that 21% to 23% of adult Americans were not "able to locate information in text", could not "make low-level inferences using printed materials", and were unable to "integrate easily identifiable pieces of information."

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#29

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:33 PM UTC

kercker wrote: post #2

"I think all kids should learn how to program at some point. I'm not sure what's the right age." I do not think all kids should learn how to program. I think programming is just one of many skills that one can master, not a must-have skill.

[deleted]

Re: Interview by a 15 Year Old

#30

Post by nether » Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 6:33 PM UTC

kercker wrote: post #2

"I think all kids should learn how to program at some point. I'm not sure what's the right age." I do not think all kids should learn how to program. I think programming is just one of many skills that one can master, not a must-have skill.

I don't think programming should crowd out interaction with other kids and with the natural world, per https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10188796. Also consider the practice of Waldorf schools, whose students include many Google kids, which discourage computer use until 8th grade: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/23/technology/at-waldorf-scho...