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Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

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Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't even remember the last time I used a USB cable on my phone for data, the only time I ever plug it in is for charging, so I don't care too much about signal integrity as long as it will charge my phone without damaging it. When I do care about signal integrity (i.e. connecting a USB hard drive to my computer, I use name-brand cables)

Without root, you need USB to start a connection with adb for debugging on the phone, even if you switch to wifi later.

I can count with zero fingers the number of times I've used ADB for debugging my phone.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#382

BTW, he put instructions for how to test at https://plus.google.com/+BensonLeung/posts/jGP5249NppF

I thought that would be how to test all usb-c's really it's how to test usb-c if you have a pixel (or in other words $1000 in your fun-time budget)

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#383
post #380

We've done a similar analysis of USB 3.0 host controllers and the state of their drivers cross-platform. It's amazing how bad the state of USB 3.0 is, even 5 years after devices started shipping. Even the latest Intel host controllers (8 & 9 series) initially shipped with bad drivers. I look forward to getting our results posted.

Haha, if it were only bad drivers. Try bad hardware: https://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-usb/msg131265.html http://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-usb/msg122354.html http://marc.info/?l=linux-usb&m=134861220631257&w=2 http://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-usb/msg63980.html ...shit's so broken I could keep doing this all day long.

Absolutely. Data corruption from VIA based host controllers was probably the worst issue we've seen, and the USB 3.0 ASMedia host controllers are probably the worst now that VIA was able to solve their issue with a driver update.

Most hardware on the market today was released before the xhci spec 1.0 was finished, and I agree that ALL hardware on the market does not even properly implement the spec that was available during its design. Fortunately, most issues can be worked around using quirks.

The hardware is the root of the problem, but I would also add that the xhci_hcd kernel module, even in the latest kernels, is well behind Microsoft in terms of handing these device-specific quirks. The Microsoft USB 3.0 stack introduced in Widows 8 solves just about every host-specific issue we've ever seen. ASMedia is the only host controller vendor that bothers to provide their own Windows 8/10 driver (both for their USB 3 Gen1 and Gen2 chips). No one else provides an alternative to the Microsoft provided usbxhci.sys. That said, all of our tests have been limited to bulk transfers, and we're only using existing user space libraries (WinUSB, LibUSB, IOKit). We do push throughput, we have tight latency requirements, and we keep a large number of buffers queued at all times, which does push the host controllers further than your typical storage device. (We make streaming data recording equipment for electrical engineers and embedded developers)

I don't want to bash xhci_hcd though; their progress has been fantastic, despite the minefield of problems created by all these host controller vendors. I would like to say a special thanks to @sarahsharp, for all of the hard work put into the xhci host controller module. Without Sarah, I don't know who will answer when the xhci_hcd doorbell rings.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#384
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a really big thing. If you look at, say, a 10-port USB3 hub on Amazon, you will see the exact same thing, down to the boards (to say nothing of the casing), being sold under three or four different brands.

The thing is for a lot of low level electronics, you can buy "identical" products from a range of manufacturers, so while I know what you're describing happens too, it's tricky because there are also plenty of designs that "make the rounds" (e.g. lots of products are just tiny variations over reference designs from a chipset designer - you see this a lot with low end Chinese tablets, which are often almost-but-not-qu…

Definitely. In this case, these are literally identical boxes I'm talking about (I have three from the same manufacturer, they put the same company name on the inside of the case).

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#385
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love Elizabeth Zwicky's explanation at http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=C4r... : > "Engineers do not give out 5s. If you tell an engineer that the possible rating scale is 1 to 5 and they like you, they give you a 4. Because tomorrow they might love you and then they would give you a 5. They probably won't, but they might, so they give you a 4 so that they have room. We all are totally okay…

Hah! I definitely do this. And I do it on the other end too, as is documented in the XKCD about 1-10 pain scales: https://xkcd.com/883/

"We all are totally okay with this." Just be aware when you cross cultural boundaries. In one real-world story, a woman was asked, on a 10 point scale, how much pain she was in. My take of the story was that she interpreted it linearly, so said something like "2", where most people would have said "9" or "10". She was told to come back when the pain got worse, when it was already excruciating. My memory might be off - it's from Bliss's essay at http://www.radiolab.org/story/233143-pain-scale/ .

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#386

I see no reason why to buy anything but Anker. I once tried to purposely destroy an Anker MicroUSB cable (bought a 5 pack that had three 3ft, one 6ft, one 1ft, didn't need the 1ft), by grabbing the head of it with clamping pliers and yanking the fuck out of it with the cable wrapped around my hand, and bending it to near 180 degrees repeatedly for about 5 minutes. I could not kill it without straight up taking wire c…

Anker was coincidentally founded by a group of ex-Google employees [1]. Anyone know anything more about them? [1] http://www.ianker.com/about_us.html

Woah! And I thought they were yet another knock-off Asian brand. They need to advertise appropriately. I held Belkin in higher regard than Anker.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#387
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And in a nutshell, that's why people buy stuff from apple. imo, their brand is "here's a good thing, and we promise it will work". Amazon's is "you're on your own, but it's really fucking cheap!" That's not to say amazon doesn't have good customer service, but the whole thing is still shit. I just wanted a [cable|dongle|hdmi adapter|battery|plant spray|charger] that was what it claimed to be and worked correctly the…

Between 2008 and 2013 when I had an iPhone, their USB cables would regularly break down on me. The problem was the white casing around the wire would break down and start to thread. So I think the rule of Apple promising high quality is true a lot of the time, it baffles me that they sold that low quality cable for so long. Ever since I switched to decives that support Micro-USB, cheap cables have yet once to break.

Every time I read something like this, I wonder "what the hell are you people doing to your Apple cables?" Now, I'm not saying you abuse your cables or anything. Maybe it was bad luck, maybe it's me just being extra careful with cables (doubt it, they're disposable in my book). But I've got a whole box of white cables. I finally threw an old 30-pin away that was so old it had the latches on the side that you had to squeeze to get the cable out. 30-pin connector was cracked, but it still worked. Threw it away only because we only have one 30-pin device left in the house, and the cable was sort of broken.

My wife did finally kill the Lightning cable in the car that was a few years old. One cable failure in probably ten years. That and $4 will get you a coffee at Starbucks, so take it FWIW. I just wonder why some have better experience with Apple cables than others.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#388

I see no reason why to buy anything but Anker. I once tried to purposely destroy an Anker MicroUSB cable (bought a 5 pack that had three 3ft, one 6ft, one 1ft, didn't need the 1ft), by grabbing the head of it with clamping pliers and yanking the fuck out of it with the cable wrapped around my hand, and bending it to near 180 degrees repeatedly for about 5 minutes. I could not kill it without straight up taking wire c…

i like Anker (good bang for buck) but they are not above fail: I have a 5 port USB charger and the middle port stopped working (thankfully the others still work, so I have a 4 port charger now) I bought a bunch of their external battery packs (aprox 15 of them) and none of those have failed)

i was in the same boat with a charger that i bought in 2013. they sent out an email explaining that was a design fault (non-reversible current limit) and they were willing to replace/refund. i wanted a replacement but unfortunately i bought it when i was travelling to the US and they can't ship outside the US. they refunded the $20 and 2 of the 5 ports still charges fine.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#389
post #165
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another fun thing I saw on Amazon a few months back was items for sale with reviews for another product. Shopping for a small FM transmitter, I found a listing where every review more than a few months old was for a roof-mounted car antenna. I suppose there is a Ship of Theseus problem when trying to detect tricks like that automatically - surely sellers should be able to reword description, update product image, and…

I've had a similar thing, where a vendor had clearly kept the same listing for many years. They were the same type of product (tablets) but the specs referenced for the oldest listings were quite hilarious. For a long time this seemed to have been fine, sort of, as the shipped products consistently were better than those described in older listings. Until they weren't. We bought one that was a substantial step down (…

Weird. Any time I've pointed out an obviously wrong listing it has been pulled down almost immediately.

Re: Google engineer writing Amazon reviews on USB-C cables that don't work

#390

I see no reason why to buy anything but Anker. I once tried to purposely destroy an Anker MicroUSB cable (bought a 5 pack that had three 3ft, one 6ft, one 1ft, didn't need the 1ft), by grabbing the head of it with clamping pliers and yanking the fuck out of it with the cable wrapped around my hand, and bending it to near 180 degrees repeatedly for about 5 minutes. I could not kill it without straight up taking wire c…

I recently got a Nexus 5X and it only came with a usb-c to usb-c cable and I wasn't able to connect it to my computer. I searched specifically for anker, usb-c to usb-a and couldn't find anything. Can anyone confirm that this is a product somewhere? This is what I went with, but it didn't seem to support data transfer. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B011N7ME48?psc=1&redirect=t...

So I realized that charging only was on by default on my device. It wasn't the cable that was the issue. It's possible that J&D cable is good.
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