Why you might want to choose Ceylon

Post by gavinking » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 6:24 PM UTC

randomThoughts9 wrote: post #41

I hope they'll redo some of the documentation with this upcoming release. Every time I read it, I am amazed by how comprehensive it is but still manages to miss some very important points. Like the fact that on the main page, the link to the online editor is not under the "Try it out" section. The explore action from that section is also misleading. Or a clean hello world, with a real project structure documented Or…

Post by gavinking » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 6:26 PM UTC

randomThoughts9 wrote: post #42

gavinking wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, if you read the linked article, a number of things are mentioned, including: - union and intersection types - an elegant and powerful representation of tuple and function types - reified generics - the cleanest solution to the problem of null - awesome modularity - a language module [that] completely abstracts the underlying runtime, and offers a set of elegant APIs that vastly improve on those available native…

Not the best place to mention this, but I never understood why, at least when talking with the functional oriented people, the union types are not explained as providing first level support for the Option, Either and the Try monads.

Post by gavinking » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 6:33 PM UTC

pron wrote: post #64

gavinking wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now you're just lying. You said: "The problem with reified generics isn't their efficiency, but that they don't play nice with other generic types on the platform (which is the vast majority)." And the context of the comment was quite clearly Ceylon interoperating with Java as anyone can verify. I have a friendly request for you: please don't comment about Ceylon on any more hackernews or reddit threads. It's great t…

Happily, as long as you don't misrepresent the difference between the languages.

Post by lomnakkus » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 6:56 PM UTC

adrusi wrote: post #32

bad_user wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A language without higher-kinded types or type-classes cannot be the language that " Scala should be ". And these aren't things that can be easily added later. And I don't think it will ever happen. And don't get me wrong, but software is about trust and I do not trust somebody like Gavin King for delivering a good language after Hibernate :) > Shapeless implicit macros to use tuples generically What can you do in Ce…

Scalajs is reasonably good, but it is retrofitted; it's a javascript backend for a language that wasn't specifically designed for a javascript backent. Ceylon was designed to compile to javascript. I haven't used either so I can't comment as to whether it actually makes a difference.

Post by lomnakkus » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 6:59 PM UTC

gavinking wrote: post #66

codazoda wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This language looks pretty cool, but I do agree with your gut. The FAQ says: "Note that not all Ceylon modules are available for both platforms. A module might be cross-platform, it might by JVM-only, or it might be JavaScript-only. Of course, ceylon.language is completely cross-platform." Having some modules for JVM and some are for JavaScript-only would make things a little bit more confusing than if the language p…

Well where there is a big difference between the underlying capabilities of the platform, differences are unavoidable. I mean, examples of things that are cross-platform in Ceylon: collections, localization, promises, regexes, HTML construction, logging, testing, dates/times. Examples of things that are platform specific: I/O, database access, filesystem access, distributed transactions, the HTTP server. That's prett…