The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop • Hacker News Board

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#101

Post by AnthonyMouse » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:36 PM UTC

dchuk wrote: post #4

Isn't this sort of a cake-and-eat-it-too situation? If you want a slim, lightweight laptop that still performs at a high level, you can't expect the old pop out batteries with the little switch we grew up with on laptops. While $400 is expensive to replace a battery, it's obviously not as simple as just popping a new one in, which is the compromise one has to make if they want a Macbook Pro. If you want easily swappa…

> If you want easily swappable batteries, get a different machine.

Apple doesn't make a different machine.

Obviously what you mean is to buy from a different vendor, which is what I expect to do when the time comes for a new laptop. But how is it good for Apple that they got my money last time and won't get it next time?

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#102

Post by davidbarker » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:37 PM UTC

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #5

> Next toss in the problem that Apple thought I didn’t have AppleCare on the machine. This is Apple’s extended warranty. This was despite me showing a receipt that showed that I bought both at the same time. Turns out that if you don’t by the machine from an Apple Store, you have to actually fill out some online form to register your warranty. If you buy at an Apple store, they automatically attach it. Anywhere else,…

I almost ran into this issue myself. I purchased a MacBook Pro in 2012, but didn't buy AppleCare at the same time. Later in the year (Apple allows you to purchase AppleCare up to one year after your hardware purchase), I decided to buy AppleCare in order to extend my warranty from one year to three years.

I bought AppleCare from Apple's own online store, but didn't realise I had to additionally register it. By chance, I had a Genius appointment at one of their stores a few months later. When I mentioned I had AppleCare, they gave me a blank look and said it wasn't on their system. They asked if I'd gone to the website to enter the serial number (which I hadn't), so I did it when I got home with a few days to spare. It was my mistake (technically), but I wasn't impressed.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#103

Post by DavidAdams » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:37 PM UTC

kristopolous wrote: post #55

Out of curiosity, am I alone in not wanting to use apple products because I find such practices as this to be unethical engineered extortion to extract more money from the consumer? I find such things exploitive and the product's success giving a green light for other manufacturers to re-engineer their products based on less honorable principles. For instance, on flip phones, batteries would eject if you dropped it i…

Apple isn't making any attempt to hide the fact that its batteries are non-user-replaceable. And I think it's clear to any reasonable person that the engineering of these devices isn't intended to generate revenue for the service department, but to create an extremely slim but solid laptop. Now, I think it's very reasonable for a consumer to decide that the'd rather have a replaceable battery than a slimmer laptop, and therefore they should avoid Apple laptops. So to answer your question, I think many would agree with you that it's a bad thing, but not too many would agree that it's unethical.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#104

Post by consto » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:37 PM UTC

dchuk wrote: post #4

Isn't this sort of a cake-and-eat-it-too situation? If you want a slim, lightweight laptop that still performs at a high level, you can't expect the old pop out batteries with the little switch we grew up with on laptops. While $400 is expensive to replace a battery, it's obviously not as simple as just popping a new one in, which is the compromise one has to make if they want a Macbook Pro. If you want easily swappa…

I don't expect to be able to pop a switch, but there is a difference between integrating the battery with the chassis and gluing the battery, keyboard and logic board together in a way that makes the laptop extremely difficult to service.

From what I can tell, to replace the battery on my year old lenovo ultrabook, you need to remove 16 easily accessible cross screws and disconnect a single ribbon cable. That shouldn't take more than 5 minutes. I guess there could be glue hiding under there.

Not to mention it continues to last up to 10 hours on a single charge.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#105

Post by yeukhon » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:39 PM UTC

relaxatorium wrote: post #31

yeukhon wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends. These days with hardware failure rate becoming higher (maybe it's just an illusion due to the ability of providing feedback on the Internet, but I argue that most of the old machines I know still work today but not so many with the more recent one), the next victim can be your SSD. Apple does get some good SSD from Samsung though. The benefit of a lock-down is controlling variable, and placing Apple at a hig…

At the risk of being "cites articles about cognitive biases guy", it's worth remembering that the reason that the old machines you know today still work is because people have generally gotten rid of all the old machines that are broken ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias )

Absolutely. I really don't have anything scientific but my really unscientific reasoning is that, even if my observation is true, the reason behind it are mass production and the ease of replacement. when you do DOA you usually get a replacement fairly quickly online. Unlike in 2000, you can get computer parts entirely online now, though computer parts are still very expensive (the good one).

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#106

Post by Bud » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:39 PM UTC

Daishiman wrote: post #83

rayiner wrote: post #11

Out of warranty battery service on a Mac ranges from $130-200: https://support.apple.com/kb/index?page=servicefaq&geo=Unite... . I think that's a reasonable price considering Lenovo charges $140 for a 75-watt hour 68+ battery for the T450s: http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/itemdetails/0C52862/460/D91DC49... . And for $130-200, they will replace your top-case (including keyboard and touchpad). I have had it done more than…

The difference is that the T450s takes literally 5 seconds todo a battery swap and you can keep using the machine during the time. No downtime, no bureaucracy, just go to Amazon and wait 2 days for your battery arrive.

Yes, and because of that, the entire design of the case is compromised, it feels like it's flexing all the time in use, it's far less durable, it contains additional cheap plastic mechanical failure points and extra connectors for said easily-replaceable battery, and all this for a part which, in the normal lifetime of most well-built laptops (aka Macs), will never ever need to be replaced.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#107

Post by franze » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:40 PM UTC

ianferrel wrote: post #65

franze wrote: post #17

new (1 month old) macbook retina, 12 inch, el capitan http://replycam.com/i/Pasted_Image_28_10_15_17_10_1BE12B12.p... fully charged battery -> 4h max ... (running mostly chrome and keynote) not really the "all day battery life" they promised ( http://www.apple.com/macbook/design/ )

Take a look at the Energy pane of the Activity Monitor sometime. Chrome on the Mac is very tough on the battery. A switch to Safari increased my battery life by about 80%.

about the energy pane http://replycam.com/i/Pasted_Image_28_10_15_17_38_1BE13189.p... what does the Avg Energy Impact number actually mean i.e.: what unit is it?

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#108

Post by glogla » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:41 PM UTC

thearn4 wrote: post #3

I'm curious what other people's perspectives are on the (what appears to me anyway) dominance of Macbooks among developers these days. Is it the convenience of a Unix-y machine with decent drivers, or something else?

Unixy machine with decent drivers, but also great resolution displays, the only unix that supports such resolution properly, and best touchpad in laptop period.

At least those are my reasons. I'd rather have something else, because I don't agree with Apple on many points (like their walled garden) but there are no alternatives.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#109

Post by joesmo » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:41 PM UTC

Assuming they resolve his Applecare issue, the cost is zero. At my Apple store, they offered to ship the laptop back to my house directly as an option. Yes, it does indeed take at least three days for any repair on any Apple laptop. If his business depends on your laptop so much, he should have a backup machine to work on for a couple of days or set one up before taking it into the shop.

Finally, how can one possibly think these machines are 'pro' quality? They are obviously aimed at and targeted at consumers. Just because it's called pro, doesn't mean it's intended for professionals. Apple stopped catering to professionals a long time ago, and even things like the Macbook Pro are obviously aimed at the end consumer. That's how they can get away with having pretty much all custom, unserviceable parts. Don't get me wrong, they're amazing laptops, but they're just not 'pro'.

Re: The Nightmare of Replacing a Battery on a Mac Laptop

#110

Post by slantyyz » Wed, Oct 28, 2015, 4:42 PM UTC

tjr wrote: post #60

andrelaszlo wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a trade-off that most buyers are aware of? I'm not sure it's as simple as "shaving off a couple of millimeters", but if that's the case I know I would personally trade those millimeters for better serviceability, especially the day I realize I need a new battery. I was thinking about switching to a Macbook Pro, but for me this is just another argument to go with something else. Can't deny that the hardware is…

I would personally trade those millimeters for better serviceability Same here. I've been a dedicated Mac user since 2002, and have been contemplating upgrading my 2010 MBP. The decreasing serviceability gives me lengthy pause, though I'm not sure that I would be happier with something else (even if it were more serviceable).

The primary driver to me switching from Mac to Windows was the lack of serviceability in newer models. That and the fact that my 2011 MBP bricked (famous heat issues that Apple pretended didn't exist until after I bought a replacement laptop).

I loved, loved, loved the 15" unibody Macbook Pro design. It allowed me to upgrade to better components (RAM, SSDs) as prices came down. The only thing I felt was missing from my 2011 MBP was USB 3. Once the shift was made to thinner bodies and soldered-on RAM, the writing was on the wall for me.

Personally, after using OSX on Intel for a decade, I found that moving to Windows 8.1 and now 10 was not nearly as jarring as I thought it would be. Windows isn't the XP I remembered using. I actually like using Windows. The one thing I really like is touchscreens on Windows PCs. Of course, depending on your preferences (and/or biases), going to Windows may not be for you.