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Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

america.aljazeera.com

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Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#71

Post by newman314 »

tptacek wrote: post #58
newman314 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the government has NEVER demonstrated any behavior in deliberate (expanded) interpretation of the law to further their interests. The lengths taken to interpret "torture" for instance. It used to be that we have a fairly logical, common sense interpretation of things but I think those days are gone. I mean, unlimited data should really mean unlimited data not subject to some arbritary cap or throttling .

Non-falsifiable argument is non-falsifiable.

I wish your echo chamber of trust were true. Unfortunately, it's not.

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#72

Post by lawnchair_larry »

jcrawfordor wrote: post #54

One of the things that concerns me about this debacle is that ongoing CISA controversy will eliminate the possibility of legislative support for information sharing for good. I appreciate that there are privacy concerns in CISA, however, it is very important to the security field that sharing of intelligence indicators become more plainly safe from a legal perspective. 'Indicators' usually consist of information abou…

"I don't want to be painted as anti-privacy and I would say that I'm not, but the principal goal of this legislation is not to send your data to the NSA"

This is what folks with this argument are missing - it doesn't matter one bit what the goal of legislation is, especially when it involves immunity for very vague things. Just because you will use it for that, does not prevent someone else from abusing it now or in the future. The point of legislation should be to protect the people.

Just like the author of the Patriot Act never intended for it to be abused the way it was. And these things are extraordinarily difficult to curtail after the fact.

"Sensenbrenner supported the Amash Amendment, a plan to defund the NSA's telephone surveillance program. "Never, he said, did he intend to allow the wholesale vacuuming up of domestic phone records, nor did his legislation envision that data dragnets would go beyond specific targets of terrorism investigations." The Amendment fell seven votes short of the number it needed to pass."

Also, I don't really buy that businesses are limited by their inability to share threat information, because they have been doing this for years.

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#74

Post by Shivetya »

mkhpalm wrote: post #73

They write these articles as if the people of the United States have any say in the matter...

it all starts with people not voting for who they are told to vote for. I am quite sure that the majority here will vote for the candidate at the top of the party that the donor class/establishment has decided wins. Just like the Republican party establishment who fights against the Tea Party (for which the media and establishment convinced many voters of both sides to mock them) the Democratic party may be having its own similar moment with Sanders. Yet it doesn't matter if you still vote for whom you are given regardless of your personal choice.

Politics in the US cannot change until people simply say no. That means at least voting for someone not from the big two or voting against your own party to show them the lesson they need.

After all, how can your vote be wasted doing so when so many are convinced their vote already doesn't matter?

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#75

Post by oceanstone »

tptacek wrote: post #55
guelo wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think they do important work why do you consider it your duty to go on every advocacy thread and say how you disagree with their tactics ? How does your tactic of constantly discouraging people from advocating for these issues serve your stated shared goals better than EFF's?

Probably for the same reason that you clearly feel it's your duty to repeat this same comment on all those threads. I'm guessing it's a shared feeling of someone being wrong on the Internet. I'm really not sure what's so complicated about this. I have a hard time thinking of legal support EFF has provided that I don't support. If EFF was just legal support, I'd be a donor. I think their technical work is mostly good;…

> Virtually all of EFF's policy advocacy, I find untrustworthy. I don't even believe they take it seriously.

This is an interesting conspiracy theory.

> Is it really that hard for you to see that as a plausible narrative?

My theory is that they really believe in what they're doing. They are based in SF, so they are surrounded by well-funded startups offering high salaries. Employees of EFF could be making small fortunes, and instead they choose to fight to secure civil rights. Why? Because some people value freedom over currency. This narrative seems more plausible.

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#78

Post by tptacek »

oceanstone wrote: post #75
tptacek wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably for the same reason that you clearly feel it's your duty to repeat this same comment on all those threads. I'm guessing it's a shared feeling of someone being wrong on the Internet. I'm really not sure what's so complicated about this. I have a hard time thinking of legal support EFF has provided that I don't support. If EFF was just legal support, I'd be a donor. I think their technical work is mostly good;…

> Virtually all of EFF's policy advocacy, I find untrustworthy. I don't even believe they take it seriously. This is an interesting conspiracy theory. > Is it really that hard for you to see that as a plausible narrative? My theory is that they really believe in what they're doing. They are based in SF, so they are surrounded by well-funded startups offering high salaries. Employees of EFF could be making small fortu…

The people doing advocacy work at EFF are generally not technologists, from what I can tell.

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#79

Post by grflynn »

₋ Four Letter Acronyms do not a policy make

₋ The net is a-central and not dependent on a single facist org to run it

₋ Pirate utopias will crop up to subvert any such control mechanisms.

⸗ 4 letter acronyms by virtue of being over⁻arching make the net stronger by way of streisand effect

Re: Despite privacy concerns, CISA bill poised for passage

#80

Post by anon4 »

grflynn wrote: post #79

₋ Four Letter Acronyms do not a policy make ₋ The net is a-central and not dependent on a single facist org to run it ₋ Pirate utopias will crop up to subvert any such control mechanisms. ⸗ 4 letter acronyms by virtue of being over⁻arching make the net stronger by way of streisand effect

It's somewhat ironic to think how "pirate" once meant someone who takes everything you have and gives nothing back, but today a pirate is a very generous individual who contributes their time and money, not to mention risking personal safety, in order to give you free access to contemporary culture.
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