Interesting. Farsi is not a major language in Syria; more people speak Kurdish than Farsi. Perhaps, and this is just a theory, that some of the refugees aren't actually coming from the Syrian civil war, but are instead attempting to simply take advantage of the largesse of the EU? If these refugees were actual refugees, they'd be in camps along the Turkish border and not applying for (and receiving) long term residency. The concept of refugee is that they go home after the hostilities. In this case, almost zero chance of that happening. It's shameful when adult men flee while many leave behind their wife and children. The women and kids ought to be the ones treated as refugees. The rest of them are simply cowards unwilling to fight for their own country.
Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
71–80 of 106 posts
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
Don't be a dick indeed, work more, so you can earn more and pay more taxes for the immigrants (if they were refugees they would stay whereever help was offered instead of storming to Germany), because those loans won't pay by itself and USA, IMF and the banks surely won't write that off. Right now my country is stormed by them and can barely keep up. Schengen is a joke, same as the EU. This will probably be down vote…
So they would stay in Hungary instead which already has more refugees per capita than Germany and is totally overwhelmed? Or in Greece which is in the middle of a crisis itself? How about Lebanon and Turkey where there are more than 10 times as much refugees, where refugees have no perspective of being able to work and where basic needs of life are not guaranteed. Free speech is about the right to express oneself, it…
No, they should stay in fucking Syria.
If they're so keen on western values such as democracy and freedom of religion, they should take up arms and fight for them, just like our ancestors did.
And if they're not keen on western values such as democracy and freedom of religion, they should stay the fuck out of the west.
The right to live in a peaceful, prosperous country is not automatic. For those of us in the west, our ancestors earned that right for us. For those in the Middle East -- well, they need to work hard now to earn that right for their descendants.
Is it fair that some are born in Europe and some are born in Syria? No. Is it fair that some are born human and some are born fish? No.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#73Earlier quoted context omitted.
You raise an interesting point, but the refugee 'crisis' is not driven by rationality, history, culture or even morality. It's a sad, numb and nihilistic political game.
Why is that? I am German - and I support the acceptance of refugees because of rationality, history, culture and especially morality.
I also support receiving them, but it is a political game. It would have made more sense to help a much larger number closer to home in countries where we could help far more people for the same amounts of money and while putting them at less risk.
The problem is that a lot of the people talking about helping them closer to home have no intention of doing so - it's an excuse not to spend money at all. It is suddenly important to help them nearer to home now, when the problem is not "contained" anymore.
Having them come to the wealthier EU countries helps drive home the seriousness of the crisis in a completely different way. Most people in Europe seems to have had no understanding of how many people need help, and have had an easy time writing these crises of as something happening far away.
That's why this is a political game. On both sides.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#74Here is what people in Germany say about immigration in a recent survey:
http://www.atlantico.fr/sites/atlantico.fr/files/u9698/2015/...
http://www.atlantico.fr/sites/atlantico.fr/files/u9698/2015/...
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#75Earlier quoted context omitted.
A step towards unified global government, one day, hopefully. You don't need sovereign nations to reap benefits of distribution, and some things are really better centralized (I'd agree that centralization may be the big scam of the 20th century - decentralization is the scam of 21st. People somehow forget that decentralized usually means very wasteful.). UE is an example of a "blob" that is not much more focused or…
Is that your best argument for the end of national sovereignty? Economies of scale?
Economies of scale, eventual ending of some unnecessary zero-sum games (a single government doesn't need to maintain much military, nor it will end up in an arms race), getting rid of nationalism, tying people's identity to the whole planet as opposed to an arbitrary subset of it. I don't really see the benefits of keeping national sovereignty. One could think that we should've grown past it already.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
So they would stay in Hungary instead which already has more refugees per capita than Germany and is totally overwhelmed? Or in Greece which is in the middle of a crisis itself? How about Lebanon and Turkey where there are more than 10 times as much refugees, where refugees have no perspective of being able to work and where basic needs of life are not guaranteed. Free speech is about the right to express oneself, it…
No, they should stay in fucking Syria. If they're so keen on western values such as democracy and freedom of religion, they should take up arms and fight for them, just like our ancestors did. And if they're not keen on western values such as democracy and freedom of religion, they should stay the fuck out of the west. The right to live in a peaceful, prosperous country is not automatic. For those of us in the west,…
Most of our ancestors did nothing to "earn that right" for us. The vast majority tried to go about their lives as before.
And a substantial number of "our" ancestors were part of messing up Syria and Iraq in the first place, going back to colonial times.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#77The only good thing about this "refugees crisis" is that it could finally cause the implosion and the end of the EU. This corrupted blob in which representatives are barely elected has to go away.
And its replacement by what? The Caliphate? Oh, fabulous.
What was there before? Sovereign countries composed of people sharing the same history, culture, values and lifestyle. Just because all these countries are geographically close doesn't mean that they should merge into one single entity.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#78I'm living in one of poor EU countries. I earn less money than they pay for refugees. Our pensioners get less money than these 'refugees' with Armani clothing...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_St._Louis
This is what happened last time refugees were turned away en masse with no option but to return to their home country: they were exterminated. The EU was formed with a "never again" attitude to this kind of catastrophe. There are already over 4 million refugees plus an estimated 6 million displaced within Syria. People have finally noticed that they're already dying trying to escape, often in the Mediterranean. The options are to take them in or send them to their deaths.
This is probably going to happen again when Yemen goes up; it doesn't help that the country is running out of groundwater while a Saudi/Iranian proxy war is being fought in it.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is that your best argument for the end of national sovereignty? Economies of scale?
Economies of scale, eventual ending of some unnecessary zero-sum games (a single government doesn't need to maintain much military, nor it will end up in an arms race), getting rid of nationalism, tying people's identity to the whole planet as opposed to an arbitrary subset of it. I don't really see the benefits of keeping national sovereignty. One could think that we should've grown past it already.
If a world government decides to spy on its own citizens, the whistleblower will have nowhere to run.
Re: Arriving in Berlin – A map made by refugees
#80I'm living in one of poor EU countries. I earn less money than they pay for refugees. Our pensioners get less money than these 'refugees' with Armani clothing...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_St._Louis This is what happened last time refugees were turned away en masse with no option but to return to their home country: they were exterminated. The EU was formed with a "never again" attitude to this kind of catastrophe. There are already over 4 million refugees plus an estimated 6 million displaced within Syria. People have finally noticed that they're already dying trying t…
Poor jews. I guess they have learned from history and help others now.
How many refugee camps for Syrian people are in Israel?