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Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

latimes.com

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Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#91

Post by FireBeyond »

outworlder wrote: post #7

That is kinda expected. This is a new company after all, with new technology. What I didn't see in the article was: how are they handling the failures? It is one thing to have a car that's unreliable, but that you can then take to a dealer and get it back a couple of days after with everything fixed. It is another if you have to fight the company every step of the way to get it fixed or, even worse, pay for their mis…

New technology, like fit and finish, door handles, etc? There are drive train issues, but there are plenty of decorative and functional issues that are solved problems. My dashboard shouldn't creak cheaply in a near $100K car.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#92

Post by makomk »

awqrre wrote: post #65
pkorzeniewski wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't take the owner satisfaction ratings too seriously, people who buy Tesla cars are mostly rich enthusiasts of new technologies and will quietly deal with a lot of issues before starting to criticize the car. If someone doesn't care about the electric engine, there's really no reason to buy a Tesla - for the same price you can get a much more luxurious german car with proven technology. It's similar to people…

I don't know about all the other technology but the electric motor(s) should be much more reliable then the conventional combustion drivetrain

Maybe, but the other parts that are failing - like the door handles, the sunroof, the center console, etc - are at least as complicated or more compared to conventional cars, because Tesla decided to add a bunch of fancy features to them. What's more, owners have been complaining that Tesla won't sell replacement parts to independent repairers and that they have to drive their car to an official service center and leave it there - and because Tesla cut out the middleman and sold online rather than through a dealer network, that can be a very long way away.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#93

Post by ZeroGravitas »

joosters wrote: post #75
awqrre wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about all the other technology but the electric motor(s) should be much more reliable then the conventional combustion drivetrain

Eventually, yes. But internal combustion engines have a head start spanning decades of fixes and reliability improvements.

I've read that in high usage scenarios (busses, taxis) the reduced maintenance is already, along with reduced fuel costs, one of the things that makes electric vehicles financially viable, even with the higher up front costs

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#94

Post by jarsin »

beat wrote: post #51
tdees40 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla' market cap is $30B. GM is $53B. Ford is $61B. If you're buying Tesla, you have to believe that they will become a huge player, and soon. They can't just be bigger, they have to be huge or else you're radically overpaying for a niche producer.

I want to play the game where we can make a fortune on high-growth stocks without any risk.

Become a bank and issue IPO's :)

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#95

Post by FireBeyond »

Overtonwindow wrote: post #72
kpwagner wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number is zero. Any more than that would be a serious scandal--can't imagine that would be legal. Market manipulation is a pretty serious crime ever since the days of Jay Gould.

I'm not so sure, remember when it was perfectly legal for members of Congress and their staff to use information gained through their jobs to make stock purchases? I mean this was just a few years ago....

When it was? It still is, as far as I recall.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#96

Post by blisterpeanuts »

tghw wrote: post #89
blisterpeanuts wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Tesla's getting AWD? That's cool. If they can get the range up over 400 miles, I would be very interested (albeit still unable to afford one). Hoping actually that I do slip on a banana peel at some point :)

They announced AWD over a year ago.

Interesting; I just went there (http://www.teslamotors.com/models) and it looks as though the AWD actually increases range. I would have thought that it would require more energy. Two separate motors, one for front and one for rear; I guess their engineers found a way to divide the work pretty equally, versus one larger motor on just the front axle.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#97

Post by sliverstorm »

tdees40 wrote: post #45
beat wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is a growth company that could be a giant. BMW is a stable old blue chip. Different market values entirely. At the individual car level, Tesla S is priced to match mid/high end sedans from BMW, Mercedes, and Audi, so that's the quality level they need to hit. And such quality isn't about reliability so much as fit and finish. Tesla is doing extremely well against very established competition in that regard.

Tesla' market cap is $30B. GM is $53B. Ford is $61B. If you're buying Tesla, you have to believe that they will become a huge player, and soon. They can't just be bigger, they have to be huge or else you're radically overpaying for a niche producer.

Well, be huge, or be smaller and maintain huge margins. That's also an avenue.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#98

Post by ZeroGravitas »

Oddly, I was just thinking the other day about how Tesla had a reputation for being a bit prototype-y but I hadn't heard anything about it recently, so I concluded they'd massively improved.

Based on this they're better, but still not great.

Was it not Consumer Reports that had a string of issues with their first model S, or was that another car magazine?

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#99

Post by digitalzombie »

6stringmerc wrote: post #43

Okay, I'll be sure to dial back my 'traditionalist' bent when it comes to vehicles and technology, it doesn't help make any points. ...but with the Model S as the 2nd iteration of a Tesla vehicle, and their first "ground up" model, how does this bode for the often stalled release of the Model X? It very much reminds me of issues faced by software companies, but there's some leeway being given to Tesla I don't think i…

> how does this bode for the often stalled release of the Model X?

I would wait for version 5 to come out when they work out all the kinks.

They'll sell like hotcakes cause CUV is a thing. They were very smart to make their 3rd car a CUV.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#100

Post by toddmorey »

pkorzeniewski wrote: post #27
simonsarris wrote: post #6

As Consumer Reports suggests, this is totally understandable. Straight from CR: > The Tesla wasn’t the only high-performance vehicle that fell below average in reliability. Others include the BMW X5 and 5 Series, and the Chevrolet Corvette. > When automakers roll out new technology, be it infotainment, transmissions, or engine variations, it often has a deleterious effect on vehicle reliability. Tesla is not only the…

I wouldn't take the owner satisfaction ratings too seriously, people who buy Tesla cars are mostly rich enthusiasts of new technologies and will quietly deal with a lot of issues before starting to criticize the car. If someone doesn't care about the electric engine, there's really no reason to buy a Tesla - for the same price you can get a much more luxurious german car with proven technology. It's similar to people…

I hear you, but it's important to note that it appears that Mercedes (a storied German luxury car with proven technology) currently has an even a lower reliability rating. That makes me think it's likely more than just company age and experience, I think there is something about a company's risk tolerance and how it relates to their eagerness to implement new tech. As the article states, the blander "appliance-like" cars might just be the most reliable.

And while I totally agree that owner bias is impacting the customer sat numbers, I think there's also a bit of a lift coming from Tesla's customer service, which gets pretty high marks. One of the smartest things they've done as a company is to invest heavily in service and responsiveness. A reliability issue sucks, but much less so if it can be resolved pleasantly and quickly.

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