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#FFFFFF Diversity

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Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#11

Post by azima »

ralonso wrote: post #3

I rarely ever comment, but posts similar to this one have been popping out more and more as of late. I am a minority. I grew up in a different country, and most of my close friends are minorities, too, both female and male; half of them being in the tech industry. (If my username didn't give it away, I'm hispanic and so are most of my acquaintances.) With that out of the way, I do not understand anything about this a…

you're speaking from your experience which is fine and YMMV, but it's useful to listen to hers about how she feels. Discounting others' experiences doesn't help. She's talking about feeling excluded from tech as a woman of color because tech has made a priority to include more women speakers, but has completely ignored that there are women of color who are ignored. The industry thinking that they're"solving" diversity by increasing women, but ignoring women of color are only solving part of the problem. The main point I'm making is inclusion matters, in the workforce and at conferences. And the benefit of having people of color speaking is being exposed to experiences and P.O.V.s from people of color. There are studies that show that people of color or from various backgrounds are better problem solvers because of adversity they've had.

Also, using anecdotal evidence from your circle of friends who have had positive experiences is dismissive of others who haven't.

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#12

Post by azima »

ivanca wrote: post #10
azima wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no it isn't. she isn't competing with one person. she's bringing to attention that intersectionality exists and the tech industry isn't paying mind to it. quote from that link: "Oppression Olympics also tends to ignore Intersectionality"

"Intersectionality" in this case means excluding black males right? That seems a bit wrong.

That applies too, but she's bringing attention to black women and directly speaking about how the tech industry is trying to fix the problem of women in tech and at the same time ignoring women of color. "solving" the problem of not a lot of women in tech by hiring white women, and completely ignoring black women doesn't solve the problem. Same thing applies to men - hiring asian men (the "model minority"), and ignoring black men doesn't solve the diversity problem.

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#14

Post by gluelogic »

martey wrote: post #8
ageek123 wrote: post #5

This article is a classic case of "Oppression Olympics" -- http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Oppression_Olympics

From the wiki page you mentioned: > People who participate in Oppression Olympics tend to ignore the fact that it's possible for multiple groups to be oppressed, and necessary to address all those problems, without choosing a single group to get all the anti-oppression activism. Oppression Olympics also tends to ignore Intersectionality, except where the existence of multiple degrees of oppression can help an individ…

The quotation does say that it is a tendency.

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#15

Post by Kiro »

Am I the only one who think it's perfectly logical that the speaker ratio is the same as the ratio of the tech population? Of course we should try hard to find minority speakers just to be proactive since we do have a diversty problem. However, when you go to a conference you want to see the best speakers and then it's only logical that a minority is less represented since, you know, there are less good speakers to choose from.

Nordic.js is doing a great job with their "50% women speakers" policy but if we forcibly try to overrepresent every minority where do we end up? "50% black trans women speakers"? I wouldn't go to such a conference since the probability of bad talks would be too high.

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#16

Post by omgtehlion »

azima wrote: post #6
ageek123 wrote: post #5

This article is a classic case of "Oppression Olympics" -- http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Oppression_Olympics

no it isn't. she isn't competing with one person. she's bringing to attention that intersectionality exists and the tech industry isn't paying mind to it. quote from that link: "Oppression Olympics also tends to ignore Intersectionality"

quote from the same link:

> ...except where the existence of multiple degrees of oppression can help an individual participant "win"

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#17

Post by [deleted] »

Kiro wrote: post #15

Am I the only one who think it's perfectly logical that the speaker ratio is the same as the ratio of the tech population? Of course we should try hard to find minority speakers just to be proactive since we do have a diversty problem. However, when you go to a conference you want to see the best speakers and then it's only logical that a minority is less represented since, you know, there are less good speakers to c…

[deleted]

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#18

Post by jackweirdy »

Kiro wrote: post #15

Am I the only one who think it's perfectly logical that the speaker ratio is the same as the ratio of the tech population? Of course we should try hard to find minority speakers just to be proactive since we do have a diversty problem. However, when you go to a conference you want to see the best speakers and then it's only logical that a minority is less represented since, you know, there are less good speakers to c…

> I wouldn't go to such a conference since the probability of bad talks would be too high.

Why?

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#19

Post by ohhimark »

azima wrote: post #11
ralonso wrote: post #3

I rarely ever comment, but posts similar to this one have been popping out more and more as of late. I am a minority. I grew up in a different country, and most of my close friends are minorities, too, both female and male; half of them being in the tech industry. (If my username didn't give it away, I'm hispanic and so are most of my acquaintances.) With that out of the way, I do not understand anything about this a…

you're speaking from your experience which is fine and YMMV, but it's useful to listen to hers about how she feels. Discounting others' experiences doesn't help. She's talking about feeling excluded from tech as a woman of color because tech has made a priority to include more women speakers, but has completely ignored that there are women of color who are ignored. The industry thinking that they're"solving" diversit…

You know, I find it strange how I can't remember a single person complaining about lack of diversity who wasn't complaining only about their specific type of diversity.

Case in point: the author is, by her own admission, a black woman and complains about the part of her identity that is not well represented: her (black) skin.

There's something almost funny in asking people to care for one's situation when the speaker isn't even speaking at large: why isn't she also complaining about asian, native american, indian and how many others not being represented?

Re: #FFFFFF Diversity

#20

Post by paulojreis »

Kiro wrote: post #15

Am I the only one who think it's perfectly logical that the speaker ratio is the same as the ratio of the tech population? Of course we should try hard to find minority speakers just to be proactive since we do have a diversty problem. However, when you go to a conference you want to see the best speakers and then it's only logical that a minority is less represented since, you know, there are less good speakers to c…

> but if we forcibly try to overrepresent every minority where do we end up? "50% black trans women speakers"? I wouldn't go to such a conference since the probability of bad talks would be too hig\

You end up with hiring quotas in companies, where a less-than-competent candidate can be hired instead of a competent one because he/she belongs to a minority. Will the bet on minority over competence will yield greater gains in the long run? That is a question for the ages. :)

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