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MH17 Report

bbc.co.uk

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Re: MH17 Report

#11

Post by waterlesscloud »

Shivetya wrote: post #7
rogeryu wrote: post #5

It's incredible that 61 airlines flew over that area during those days. That day alone, 160 airplanes flew over East Ukraine before MH17 was hit. Even if it's safe to fly at 10k height, what happens if you have problems with your plane, like a failing engine? Next time I fly I'm going to check over which countries we fly.

the take away is, do not fly over areas of conflict. why the international community allowed it, let alone individual airlines did not take their own action, is beyond me. On second thought, I wonder if an airline can elect to not fly on certain corridors because they declare a risk?

My brother and my niece will be on the second leg of their journey to South Africa in a few hours. Continuing on from London. They will overfly a couple of areas of conflict.

I dunno how else they could go, though.

Re: MH17 Report

#12

Post by escapologybb »

Can anyone break down how they knew that the missile exploded within a one square metre volume of air, just above and to the front of the plane please?

Do they do it just from the pattern of debris, or do they use other methods as well. I think I got that they can use the microphones in the cockpit to work out the direction the missile fragments came from, but not quite sure on the details.

Thanks in advance!

Re: MH17 Report

#13

Post by avar »

Shivetya wrote: post #7
rogeryu wrote: post #5

It's incredible that 61 airlines flew over that area during those days. That day alone, 160 airplanes flew over East Ukraine before MH17 was hit. Even if it's safe to fly at 10k height, what happens if you have problems with your plane, like a failing engine? Next time I fly I'm going to check over which countries we fly.

the take away is, do not fly over areas of conflict. why the international community allowed it, let alone individual airlines did not take their own action, is beyond me. On second thought, I wonder if an airline can elect to not fly on certain corridors because they declare a risk?

Not everyone was continuing to fly over Ukraine. Some including British Airways and Air France had already stopped flying over Ukraine months earlier[1] due to heightened risk in the area. Malaysian Airlines decided the risk was worth it.

1. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-28356745 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_17#Ba...

Re: MH17 Report

#14

Post by jinst8gmi »

ed_blackburn wrote: post #6

I anticipate lot of bluster. The perpetrators perhaps being named but ultimately nothing happening. A lot of nations do not recognise courts higher than their own sovereignty so will not extradite. Especially if they deem the charge to be politically motivated. Right or wrong. Russia will contest this report, and any other. Basically someone messed up with a borrowed bit of heavy kit and a tragedy ensued. There will…

> Basically someone messed up with a borrowed bit of heavy kit and a tragedy ensued.

"borrowed" ?

Re: MH17 Report

#15

Post by mc32 »

rogeryu wrote: post #5

It's incredible that 61 airlines flew over that area during those days. That day alone, 160 airplanes flew over East Ukraine before MH17 was hit. Even if it's safe to fly at 10k height, what happens if you have problems with your plane, like a failing engine? Next time I fly I'm going to check over which countries we fly.

Yes, this is pretty incredible. I somewhat can see the Ukrainians being too busy with other things to recategorize their airspace, but the carriers as well as international airtraffic control didn't think to recategorize the airspace, that's a failure of leadership and responsibility.

Re: MH17 Report

#16

Post by guard-of-terra »

ptaipale wrote: post #8
rogeryu wrote: post #5

It's incredible that 61 airlines flew over that area during those days. That day alone, 160 airplanes flew over East Ukraine before MH17 was hit. Even if it's safe to fly at 10k height, what happens if you have problems with your plane, like a failing engine? Next time I fly I'm going to check over which countries we fly.

Depending on your destination, you will find out that you'll fly over Pakistani tribal regions, Iraq or other unstable areas. Or the Gobi desert or the Arctic ocean. Places where you would not wish to land. There was nothing particularly strange about flying over Ukrainian airspace, because you don't really expect civilian planes to be shot down, even by rogue militias that are in power in some areas. The very fact t…

"and probably that someone was drunk"

It's a strange assumption. I doubt drunk people ever get to be around Buk launchers (even in separatists' camps)

You should keep in mind that rebels shot down military plane allegedly carrying 40 Ukrainian soldiers (and crew) - month before MH17. This was a serious military transport plane Il-76, not some light planer. They shot other aircraft too. One could imagine that shooting at planes has become norm rather than unexpected at the area.

Re: MH17 Report

#17

Post by lennartkoopmann »

escapologybb wrote: post #12

Can anyone break down how they knew that the missile exploded within a one square metre volume of air, just above and to the front of the plane please? Do they do it just from the pattern of debris, or do they use other methods as well. I think I got that they can use the microphones in the cockpit to work out the direction the missile fragments came from, but not quite sure on the details. Thanks in advance!

They triangulated it using the three microphones I guess. Also I guess you can figure that out by looking at the debris pattern because they seem to have a lot of knowledge about the used rocket.

Re: MH17 Report

#18

Post by guard-of-terra »

ed_blackburn wrote: post #6

I anticipate lot of bluster. The perpetrators perhaps being named but ultimately nothing happening. A lot of nations do not recognise courts higher than their own sovereignty so will not extradite. Especially if they deem the charge to be politically motivated. Right or wrong. Russia will contest this report, and any other. Basically someone messed up with a borrowed bit of heavy kit and a tragedy ensued. There will…

Keep in mind that around 6000 people (maybe outdated number) died from that war so far. I doubt they're getting justice for them or their families either. They might get a scapegoat in some time, however. Even a very guilty one.

Re: MH17 Report

#19

Post by jinst8gmi »

escapologybb wrote: post #12

Can anyone break down how they knew that the missile exploded within a one square metre volume of air, just above and to the front of the plane please? Do they do it just from the pattern of debris, or do they use other methods as well. I think I got that they can use the microphones in the cockpit to work out the direction the missile fragments came from, but not quite sure on the details. Thanks in advance!

They also reconstructed the front section of the plane from the wreckage which indicated where the shrapnel had entered.
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