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Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

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Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#41
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, there's one way to make such a change: pay everyone an unconditional basic income of, say, 24$ (= 3$ * 8h) per day. But I agree, Frondo's comment seems to be rife with assumptions.

You can't really do that without raising taxes, which would probably affect the other $12.

Probably, yes. Though they could do it directly with central bank money (instead of `traditional' quantitative easing). `Helicopter money' is actually seriously discussed amongst economists.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#42
post #39
post #12

I have never gotten into Mechanical Turk, but I do freelance work online. My "hourly wage" depends in part on how together I am. I am medically handicapped. Some days, I am fairly together and can make around $12/hour -- not dissimilar form what I was making at a corporate job after a few pay raises. On a so-so day, it can take me forever to complete tasks, lowering my "hourly wage." However, I still need the money,…

> If you take it from me, I am left with what? Panhandling? Prostitution? ...??? Is there no welfare for people who aren't able to make a living in your country?

Welfare in the US (ssi in his case, since he has a disability) is a pathetically small amount, and a headache to get.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#43
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you recruit those people?

There's a large-work-at-home community on the web, with sites that list sites, as well as forums and review sites. Search under "work at home". We also got good word-of-mouth because the pay was reasonable, and the payouts were fast, although you continuously have to reassure people that it's not a scam :-(

>"although you continuously have to reassure people that it's not a scam :-("

It's unfortunate, but that is the nature of the broad term "work from home", especially on the internet. I think tech-savvy individuals have, in parallel, been constantly telling individuals that such keywords are usually scams.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#44
post #39
post #12

I have never gotten into Mechanical Turk, but I do freelance work online. My "hourly wage" depends in part on how together I am. I am medically handicapped. Some days, I am fairly together and can make around $12/hour -- not dissimilar form what I was making at a corporate job after a few pay raises. On a so-so day, it can take me forever to complete tasks, lowering my "hourly wage." However, I still need the money,…

> If you take it from me, I am left with what? Panhandling? Prostitution? ...??? Is there no welfare for people who aren't able to make a living in your country?

As somebody involved in communities with a large amount of people who can't work for one reason or another... being on significant welfare for being literally unable to work, or only being able to work a part-time job, is incredibly stressful.

The issue is, conservative Government parties point to people taking welfare without meeting the requirements for it as a significant issue that costs countries large amounts of money. To solve this problem, Governments set up welfare departments to be all but adversarial, with near-constant - and, worse, unpredictable - changes in requirements forcing a lot of mental effort to be taken just to keep proving and re-proving that you can't work, and welfare agencies taking the default stance that any individual taking welfare is likely to be fraudulent.

The result is that keeping up with the welfare system is often as stressful as a full-time job in itself, if not moreso as you're very aware that society and your Government both think of you as someone who they'd really prefer just died.

Of course, as those most affected by the discrimination against those on welfare are generally the people with the smallest voices - unemployed or low-wage workers, those with disability, and often further minorities - it's not going to change in a long time.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#45

Hasn't mturk in the years since this article was written essentially frozen non-US workers out of the system?

Non-us requesters, even. I just got this from their site after wanting to setup an account:

""" Why is the country set as United States?

At this time Mechanical Turk does not support Requesters from countries outside the United States. """

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#46
post #5

I guess the wages are low because any task has to be verified by another person (possibly in a consensus-test, where the input of the other person is verified against your input). Or at least, that's what I'm guessing.

Or, the wages are so low is because humans are inherianty cheap, and willing to exploit people especially when no one is looking. Would this website work if they required a clear picture of the work provider, and a brief resume?

>"humans are inherianty cheap"

Desperate humans are cheap, I would say. And until we have a completely global market place for labour, there will always be a large disparity between what we think an individual is worth, and how little an individual is willing to work for due to their local circumstances.

As usual, I fault the governments that promise but don't fix, election after election.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#47
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a large-work-at-home community on the web, with sites that list sites, as well as forums and review sites. Search under "work at home". We also got good word-of-mouth because the pay was reasonable, and the payouts were fast, although you continuously have to reassure people that it's not a scam :-(

>" although you continuously have to reassure people that it's not a scam :-( " It's unfortunate, but that is the nature of the broad term "work from home", especially on the internet. I think tech-savvy individuals have, in parallel, been constantly telling individuals that such keywords are usually scams.

Most of these schemes put front and center the idea that you're working at home and getting paid to do simple tasks. They aren't putting up the actual requirements of the work or why you're doing it, which is what a serious employment offer would be concerned with.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#48
post #2

I can see some appeal to making a miniscule amount of money in my spare time on Mechanical Turk. I mean, I already spend my spare time doing pointless tasks such as solving crossword puzzles and commenting on things. I would see it as a game where the goal is to try and make as much money as possible with as little work. I can also see that unemployed people might enjoy it just as a way of feeling like they're doing…

I tried Mechanical Turk years and years ago. At that time there were really no tasks available that paid an amount that could consistently get you anywhere close to minimum wage. The only ones that seemed appealing on the surface were these audio transcriptions. I type over 100wpm and 9 minutes of audio took me over an hour to transcribe. I got like $2, and never even bothered withdrawing it. If any individual on Mec…

I used to do data entry and transcription for $12/hour (not adjusted for 15+ years of inflation) and was able to reach about $4-5/hour on Mechanical Turk when I tried it. As I was out of practice, I think $7/hour would be feasible with time. But one thing people forget is that the federal minimum wage is actually closer to $8/hour when you include the doubling of FICA taxes on self-employment income.

Still, the ability to login and earn even $5/hour at arbitrary times of the day may be desirable for a segment of the population that's perhaps a bit asocial and chooses an RV lifestyle.

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#49

I run a crowdsourced content site that is a kind of Wikipedia for news (see my profile for link). When we first started we wanted to attract Wikipedia writers, who write for free. Those writers are mainly young, white Americans, like the Mechanical Turk writers mentioned in the article. But they wouldn't come over, because they like fighting on Wikipedia for free. So I offered $1 per post to write 50-100 words summar…

> "finding writers who will put in work now, with the hope of a bigger payout later."

It is weird how corporate success demeans those at the bottom. I mean ... you've just exposed "the great exposure" fallacy.

"Work hard enough and we will start to include the carrot."

Re: Who Makes Below Minimum Wage on Mechanical Turk?

#50

I run a crowdsourced content site that is a kind of Wikipedia for news (see my profile for link). When we first started we wanted to attract Wikipedia writers, who write for free. Those writers are mainly young, white Americans, like the Mechanical Turk writers mentioned in the article. But they wouldn't come over, because they like fighting on Wikipedia for free. So I offered $1 per post to write 50-100 words summar…

> "finding writers who will put in work now, with the hope of a bigger payout later." It is weird how corporate success demeans those at the bottom. I mean ... you've just exposed "the great exposure" fallacy. "Work hard enough and we will start to include the carrot."

I'm not really sure how giving writers an opportunity to use their time as an investment demeans them, but perhaps I've read your post the wrong way. There are three ways to get people involved: 1. Pay them directly; make a system where they work for free for a noble cause; or let them invest their time now with the hope of larger revenue-share payments later. This latter way actually empowers contributors by treating them like investors.

I see no difference between an investor putting in $1000 in cash, and a contributor investing $1000 of their time, because all we would do with the investors $1000 would be to pay the contributors. In the case where the investor adds cash, as the company grows the investor gets the long-term rewards, while the writer just gets paid $1000 and has no long-term position. However, when the contributor invests their time, we don't need the investor. Instead, the contributor gets the long-term reward for their work as the value of their content rises. So rather than consigning contributors to a fixed wage and giving the benefit of their work to investors, we allow writers to invest in their own future. Of course, that all depends on whether they think the business will grow so that a decent amount of revenue can be shared.

As I pointed out above, many of the work-at-home workers need to get instant cash so this system doesn't work for them, and the Wikipedia people will work for free (the fools!). Our challenge is to recruit people who are willing to treat their participation as an investment. But if it works, they will make a lot more money than they would in any other system.

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