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Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

cee.lse.ac.uk

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Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#31

Post by marincounty »

dubhrosa wrote: post #17
_98fj wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes conversations about this very confusing is the fact that neurotransmitters and "chemical imbalances" cannot be seen in isolation. What we are talking about is signalling inside particular structures. Changes in signalling over time effect changes in structure, just like different behaviour does. (actually different behaviour IS change in signalling) Thus it's no wonder that psychiatric drugs have so many u…

Genuine question: has there been any study that actually measured the "levels" of neurotransmitters in the brain and correlated them with the subjects' behavior? Has there been any study that actually demonstrates what the normal levels of these chemicals are in adults and children, and what the normal range is, and what environmental and nutritional factors can influence them? I ask because I constantly hear the "ch…

In the nineties, and and up to about ten years ago, I would hear Doctors mention "chemical imbalance".

Today, I couldn't imagine a medical doctor claiming a person/patient has a chemical imbalance. The truth is they just don't know what causes mental illness, and most mental disabilities.

For awhile, it looked like they could increase dopamine, decrease serotonin, blah, blah, etc. and they were finally getting a handle on these complicated psychological problems.

Well, they were wrong with their chemical imbalance theories, and they are back to speculation--wild speculation in most cases. Out of all the medical specialties, Psychiarty has not made much progress from the 50's. At least they aren't carring around ice picks and severing the frontal lobes though.

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#32

Post by zmk_ »

One thing that jumps at me in this study is the high risk of investigating two different populations with different characteristics. Foreign students are more likely to be high achievers (and high-achieving women), quantitative degrees are also in higher demand from foreigners and more likely to be in English. If you are Dutch you can pick whatever university/field you want and they will admit you (exception is medicine); thus there is a higher chance of low-achievers (who drive the results) to be in that part of the sample. I am suspicious of results which are driven by the tail of the distribution and die out in time (when that tail drops out).

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#33

Post by tomp »

zmk_ wrote: post #32

One thing that jumps at me in this study is the high risk of investigating two different populations with different characteristics. Foreign students are more likely to be high achievers (and high-achieving women), quantitative degrees are also in higher demand from foreigners and more likely to be in English. If you are Dutch you can pick whatever university/field you want and they will admit you (exception is medic…

Didn't the study compare the performance of a group before and after the marihuana ban, with the natives being the control group? the differences you list (motivation, skill, effort) didn't change (except as an effect of the ban).

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#34

Post by brc »

Camillo wrote: post #11
guard-of-terra wrote: post #2

Steve Yegge comes to rescue: http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2009/04/have-you-ever-legali... So... one minor, teeny-weeny almost insigificant caveat before I continue: I have smoked marijuana (and inhaled it, deeply) on more occasions than I can count. And yet I'm almost undoubtedly smarter than your kid that you're so goddamned worried about. I skipped three grades (3rd, 7th and 8th), entered high school at age 11 a…

That doesn't even make sense. Who's to say he would not have done even better if he had not smoked pot? How can he assume his case generalizes across the population? How does someone who is So Very Smart not realize this? Did his AP courses not give him an inkling of the scientific method? For what it's worth, that blog post caused a tiny increase in my propensity to believe marijuana is harmful.

Yes, precisely. So many times a debate is about whether or not something does measurable harm. People or policies with a measure if success are often cited as evidence of lack of harm. Whether it's taking drugs or raising the tax rate, if the subjects in question continue to prosper, it is assumed no harm is done.

However people forget to ask the question whether the outcomes are maximised? Could the blogger have been the next Steve Jobs but for the weed use? I don't pretend to have the answer but I see the question is rarely asked.

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#35

Post by DarkContinent »

The real concern with this study is not the possible negative effects of marijuana (which are already known) but the moral correctness of its legalization. I personally have not and never will smoke pot, but that doesn't mean I support the continuing ban in America. Everyone has the right to determine his own destiny, and if engaging in personally (but not socially) destructive behaviors like smoking pot is a person's chosen destiny, he shouldn't be held back by dated laws restricting personal freedom.

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#36

Post by mtreis86 »

tensor wrote: post #3
guard-of-terra wrote: post #2

Steve Yegge comes to rescue: http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2009/04/have-you-ever-legali... So... one minor, teeny-weeny almost insigificant caveat before I continue: I have smoked marijuana (and inhaled it, deeply) on more occasions than I can count. And yet I'm almost undoubtedly smarter than your kid that you're so goddamned worried about. I skipped three grades (3rd, 7th and 8th), entered high school at age 11 a…

Steve Yegge is not a scientist and prone to highly emotional rants. Further, your situation, whatever it is, is an anecdote, not sufficient to draw a conclusion. I wonder if the same is true of alcohol, given the two substances are so close. Whatever the conclusion, it's not justification to ban either of course. There are many other facets of the problem to consider.

Cannabis and Alcohol share just about nothing in common. Not the chemical structure, the method of consumption, the neuro-physical effects, nor the after-effects. They both do get you a high in their way, but aside from that, nothing. They don't feel much alike, and are very different in terms of long term and short term cognitive effects.

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#37

Post by dubhrosa »

marincounty wrote: post #31
dubhrosa wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: has there been any study that actually measured the "levels" of neurotransmitters in the brain and correlated them with the subjects' behavior? Has there been any study that actually demonstrates what the normal levels of these chemicals are in adults and children, and what the normal range is, and what environmental and nutritional factors can influence them? I ask because I constantly hear the "ch…

In the nineties, and and up to about ten years ago, I would hear Doctors mention "chemical imbalance". Today, I couldn't imagine a medical doctor claiming a person/patient has a chemical imbalance. The truth is they just don't know what causes mental illness, and most mental disabilities. For awhile, it looked like they could increase dopamine, decrease serotonin, blah, blah, etc. and they were finally getting a hand…

The most extreme critics of SSRIs would argue that the alterations to the brain caused by these drugs are severe and irreversible. Another genuine question: what makes us so sure that future generations won't look back at the widespread prescription of brain altering drugs that operate on practically immeasurable and poorly understood mechanisms, as being so different to lobotomies?

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#38

Post by dubhrosa »

_98fj wrote: post #22
dubhrosa wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: has there been any study that actually measured the "levels" of neurotransmitters in the brain and correlated them with the subjects' behavior? Has there been any study that actually demonstrates what the normal levels of these chemicals are in adults and children, and what the normal range is, and what environmental and nutritional factors can influence them? I ask because I constantly hear the "ch…

I wanted to elaborate on that point. You are completely right. There are laboratories measuring that stuff from urine and saliva. They are expensive and the results also need to be controlled for things like normal thyroid function, so you can map properly derive levels in the brain. Also the tests need to be done at different times of the day. The test-results include ranges. Interpreting and correlating the values…

What kind of things can they measure from urine and saliva? Can you point at any literature on this, would love to read more about it.

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#39

Post by 98Windows »

DarkContinent wrote: post #35

The real concern with this study is not the possible negative effects of marijuana (which are already known) but the moral correctness of its legalization. I personally have not and never will smoke pot, but that doesn't mean I support the continuing ban in America. Everyone has the right to determine his own destiny, and if engaging in personally (but not socially) destructive behaviors like smoking pot is a person'…

How harmful would cannabis have to be to people until you'd consider banning it?

Re: Cannabis Access and Academic Performance

#40

Post by rickdale »

I want to note that this is how THC can effect academic performance. There are other compounds in marijuana other than THC and although THC is the leading compound in most cannabis, in the medical cannabis world there are certain strains like Cannatonic that will test 0%THC with 10-20%CBD. CBD is not like THC and has a lot of different medical benefits associated with it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabidiol

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