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Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

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Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#121

Post by ambicapter »

morgante wrote: post #42
toomuchtodo wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No downvote even if I disagree. Once your platform begins to become ubiquitous (Facebook Messenger), it starts to have certain responsibilities, similiar to a utility but not quite that far. Now I'm prepared for the downvotes, but I don't think its wrong to expect certain behavior from tech companies in certain segments once they reach a particular size. A compromise would be to allow Facebook users to get verified (…

> Once your platform begins to become ubiquitous (Facebook Messenger), it starts to have certain responsibilities, similiar to a utility but not quite that far. I think this is a decent argument. Facebook is pretty close to being a digital utility at this point. But, a logical corollary of that argument is that if Facebook is a utility it's also expected for everyone to have it. Hence, it's fully okay for services to…

> if Facebook is a utility it's also expected for everyone to have it.

How so? I am in no way required to live with running water and electricity in my house. Even things that are tangentially related, like my workplace requiring me to bathe and wash my clothes occasionally, don't require me to have the equipment to do so in my house.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#122

Post by taswal_tmanir »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #108
dunkelheit wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real-name internet identities have some drawbacks compared to their real-world counterparts: 1. In real life its fairly easy (and I would say healthy) to have multiple "identities", say your workday exquisitely professional identity and weekend identity which enjoys goofy antics with friends. In infinitely googlable internet - not so much. I guess mitigating this is the idea behind google+ circles but I have never us…

> In real life its fairly easy (and I would say healthy) to have multiple "identities", say your workday exquisitely professional identity and weekend identity which enjoys goofy antics with friends. I think Facebook primarily targets the second one. Though personally, I find the whole concept of this type of multiple identities weird. Why should I present a different identity at work than I do in personal affairs? A…

> Though personally, I find the whole concept of this type of multiple identities weird. Why should I present a different identity at work than I do in personal affairs?

Most people act more formally at work than they would otherwise. It's the same idea.

> And if your boss objects to your weekend parties, then (unless we're talking PR-heavy industry, you being in the spotlight) you should consider changing jobs. Caring about such issues is as sign of serious problems in the company.

If you have a secure job, or are important to the company, maybe.

Many younger people are not so secure in their jobs, however, or live in a highly religious area, or both. A Facebook user still dependent on their strict parents could also be ruined by a stray pic.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#123

Post by techdragon »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #100
Swizec wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somehow the Wi-Fi network theory sounds even creepier than geo-tracking. Also in my example, I didn't usually connect to any Wi-Fi because I have LTE. But of course I don't turn off wi-fi when I leave the house so my phone still does network discovery.

Does it now? By Wi-Fi tracking I'm thinking of SSID matching (which are public information), not pinging devices inside a single network. Your data point about on-but-not-connected Wi-Fi supports both geotracking and SSID tracking. We need more data!

Facebook harvests a mountain of data about you when you use the new Messenger app. I swear the only purpose it has as a separate app is to be far worse than they think they can get away with the main Facebook app being.

It's probably from the messenger data that they correlated your proximity.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#124

Post by [deleted] »

unclebucknasty wrote: post #47
toomuchtodo wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No downvote even if I disagree. Once your platform begins to become ubiquitous (Facebook Messenger), it starts to have certain responsibilities, similiar to a utility but not quite that far. Now I'm prepared for the downvotes, but I don't think its wrong to expect certain behavior from tech companies in certain segments once they reach a particular size. A compromise would be to allow Facebook users to get verified (…

What I don't get is why Facebook's users don't just disengage. Instead, Facebook is treated as some basic human right. Here, with some vague "responsibilities akin to a utility, but not quite that far". I mean, that really sounds kind of, well, made up. Who's defining these responsibilities? In fact, Facebook is not a public utility, but a private company. And, unlike with a public utility, the public to which they a…

[deleted]

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#125

Post by taswal_tmanir »

ryandrake wrote: post #96
natch wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of the meme of first world problems versus third world problems. Essentially, you are saying that because it saves you some annoyance, it's a good tradeoff, even if that means that a few others face not annoyance, but actual existential threats of death, violence, imprisonment, dismemberment, etc. http://violetblue.tumblr.com/post/130440543695/why-im-sittin... Edit: and yes, participation in Facebook…

What is the price I pay for not participating in Facebook?

You might lose all online communication options with at least some of your friends. This is unacceptable to many/most people, hence why they join Facebook and end up perpetuating the effect.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#126

Post by ferrari8608 »

Swizec wrote: post #74
gurkendoktor wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People who are trying to disconnect their Facebook identity from their real world identity are not using Facebook the way it's meant to be used and should probably just leave it. Some people use their pseudonym (usually a nick name) in real life as well, except for work, and I think separating work from Facebook is exactly how Facebook should be used. (There's always LinkedIn for work...) Another thing I see a lot…

> Tellingly, my female FB friends are much more likely to obfuscate their names (and get blocked for it). This is the part of Facebook that's really creepy. As a guy who used to date around a lot, I was surprised by how well the "find user" function works. You connect with someone on Tinder, and meet up in real life. You have no friends in common, no digital connection other than a week-old Tinder conversation consis…

It's probably due to the Tinder app being tied to your Facebook account.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#127

Post by CPLX »

yaur wrote: post #89
Swizec wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tellingly, my female FB friends are much more likely to obfuscate their names (and get blocked for it). This is the part of Facebook that's really creepy. As a guy who used to date around a lot, I was surprised by how well the "find user" function works. You connect with someone on Tinder, and meet up in real life. You have no friends in common, no digital connection other than a week-old Tinder conversation consis…

> I don't know how they do it. But they do it. A big avenue for this is phone numbers. If you have exchanged phone numbers or texted and either person has the facebook app installed on their phone they may show up on "people you may know"

This is almost certainly it. It comes from adding each other to your smartphones address book so a name shows instead of a number.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#128

Post by Riseed »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #108
dunkelheit wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real-name internet identities have some drawbacks compared to their real-world counterparts: 1. In real life its fairly easy (and I would say healthy) to have multiple "identities", say your workday exquisitely professional identity and weekend identity which enjoys goofy antics with friends. In infinitely googlable internet - not so much. I guess mitigating this is the idea behind google+ circles but I have never us…

> In real life its fairly easy (and I would say healthy) to have multiple "identities", say your workday exquisitely professional identity and weekend identity which enjoys goofy antics with friends. I think Facebook primarily targets the second one. Though personally, I find the whole concept of this type of multiple identities weird. Why should I present a different identity at work than I do in personal affairs? A…

> Why should I present a different identity at work than I do in personal affairs?

In the tech industry, perhaps not so much of an issue. But, for example, I'm sure many K-8 teachers have a "work" self and a "weekend" self that don't (and/or shouldn't) mix well.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#129

Post by dredmorbius »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #66
gorena wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure that you can already do all of this. I can't currently find the option to entirely de-list from search, but I thought I had it on before.

You can de-list pretty much all information about you - without a publicly visible profile picture and your current location (city/country), you're pretty much impossible to find among others who share your first and last name. And yes, Facebook has enough users now that if you live in a big city, it's likely you'll find a few people sharing your first and last name in the same city.

I know many people with highly distinctive, and, in a surprising number of cases, entirely unique names. Some rather surprisingly.

Name plus city plus one other piece of data (approximate birth date, school(s) attended, former employer(s), a few other associates/contacts, profession) are very often enough to uniquely identify an individual, even with an otherwise common identity.

Re: Global coalition to Facebook: “Authentic names” are dangerous for your users

#130

Post by e12e »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #54
toomuchtodo wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You misunderstand me. My apologies for not explaining properly. I'm not saying people are entitled to Facebook; I'm saying if users use Facebook, regulations should be in place to dictate to Facebook how those users should be treated. Corporations will take as much as they can, which is why regulations exist.

> I'm saying if users use Facebook, regulations should be in place to dictate to Facebook how those users should be treated. As much as I hate what Facebook is doing, I don't think this is anywhere near the right answer. Besides, do you really think governments want to see less information collected, when having that information makes it so convenient for them to obtain?

Well, governments gave us TOR. So just because some parts of government(s) want to listen in, record and have available all the things -- this isn't universal.
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