The Decline of ‘Big Soda’ • Hacker News Board

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#101

Post by tzs » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:05 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #72

tzs wrote: post #2

Submission from 18 minutes earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10324311 Submission from 19 hours earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10321396

A small number of reposts is ok if a story hasn't had significant attention yet [1]. After that, we bury reposts as dupes. This is the main device for migitating the randomness that otherwise dominates which stories make it off /newest [2]. Basically, it's ok to roll the dice a few times. If we see a good-by-HN's-standard story that fell through the cracks, we've been emailing the submitters and inviting them to repo…

I was aware of that. That's why I didn't flag the duplicates.

My purpose in providing back links on each duplicate to the earlier posts was to try to avoid fragmenting the comments. When there are two submissions 18 minutes apart, there is a decent chance comments will be split between them.

> If we see a good-by-HN's-standard story that fell through the cracks, we've been emailing the submitters and inviting them to repost it. We invited coloneltcb to repost this one

That seems pretty inelegant for a site named "Hacker News". Why can't you diddle the database to give the original another shot? The "invite a resubmission" approach makes the submitter have to figure out a different URL, and increases the risk of comment fragmentation.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#102

Post by _delirium » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:06 PM UTC

mikenyc wrote: post #95

_delirium wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For now I think Starbucks et al are benefiting from being culturally identified as more upper/middle-class. Obesity stereotypes seem to have fixated mostly on a "people of Walmart" type image of the fat, slobbish lower classes. So even though a 12-oz Starbucks caramel latte is far worse than a 12-oz Coke, it gets a pass.

Sugar-wise, the can of coke is about 70% worse. 12-oz caramel macchiato = 23 grams of sugar http://www.starbucks.com/menu/drinks/espresso/caramel-macchi... 12-oz can of coke = 39 grams of sugar http://www.coca-colaproductfacts.com/en/coca-cola-products/c...

Good point, the source of calories isn't the same mix, even though the latte has more total calories (200 calories/12oz, vs. 140). Though I was thinking of the caramel latte rather than macchiato, which is a bit closer, at 27g of sugar: http://www.starbucks.com/menu/drinks/espresso/flavored-latte....

And since it's autumn, it's now time for their signature seasonal drink, the pumpkin spice latte, 300 calories and 39g of sugar per 12oz: http://www.starbucks.com/menu/drinks/espresso/pumpkin-spice-.... You can bring that down to 240 calories and a mere 37g of sugar if you ask for no whipped cream.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#103

Post by ddlatham » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:07 PM UTC

at-fates-hands wrote: post #97

klenwell wrote: post #25

When Mr. Nutter was fighting the soda tax battle, he kept a bottle of Mountain Dew and a container with 17 teaspoons of sugar — the amount in the bottle — on the table in the center of his office. It was a good “conversation piece,” he said, about the surprising number of calories in a typical soda. I think this is key. Better information and transparency is having an effect. I'm glad to hear we're approaching a poin…

The sad thing is you can do this for pretty much anything but water. 15.2 oz Minute Maid orange juice: 45g of sugar: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/calories/subway-minute-maid... 12 oz Welchs grape juice? 63g of sugar: http://i2.wp.com/afterthekidsleave.files.wordpress.com/2014/... Something healthier like Vitamin Water - right? Vitamin Water - 8oz 13g: http://www.betteroffwell.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/vita..…

How about tea, coffee, wine, even sparkling or mineral (not just plain) water.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#104

Post by caseysoftware » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:07 PM UTC

austenallred wrote: post #89

caseysoftware wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why we haven't had anyone start smoking in decades.. Soda sales are down but obesity is still up, so the calories are coming from somewhere. If you believe the other common stories, we're drinking the calories. I'd wager they come from the rise of coffee-based beverages - which would not be considered soda - but I don't have data to back that up.

I'd be curious to see how much of the decline of "soda" is a result of the move to "energy drinks"

I was thinking about that too but since they're sugared and carbonated, I assume they're often classified as soda too? (Not 100% sure there.)

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#105

Post by agumonkey » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:08 PM UTC

gaius wrote: post #98

caseysoftware wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why we haven't had anyone start smoking in decades.. Soda sales are down but obesity is still up, so the calories are coming from somewhere. If you believe the other common stories, we're drinking the calories. I'd wager they come from the rise of coffee-based beverages - which would not be considered soda - but I don't have data to back that up.

Soda sales are down but obesity is still up Because it's not just about calories in but calories out too. People spending all day sitting in front of screens replacing all other forms of both work and play...

Modern westerner lifestyle is really damaging. Since I can drive a car I don't walk anymore. My belly reminds it to me everyday.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#106

Post by maxerickson » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:10 PM UTC

at-fates-hands wrote: post #97

klenwell wrote: post #25

When Mr. Nutter was fighting the soda tax battle, he kept a bottle of Mountain Dew and a container with 17 teaspoons of sugar — the amount in the bottle — on the table in the center of his office. It was a good “conversation piece,” he said, about the surprising number of calories in a typical soda. I think this is key. Better information and transparency is having an effect. I'm glad to hear we're approaching a poin…

The sad thing is you can do this for pretty much anything but water. 15.2 oz Minute Maid orange juice: 45g of sugar: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/calories/subway-minute-maid... 12 oz Welchs grape juice? 63g of sugar: http://i2.wp.com/afterthekidsleave.files.wordpress.com/2014/... Something healthier like Vitamin Water - right? Vitamin Water - 8oz 13g: http://www.betteroffwell.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/vita..…

It is not a mild form of arsenic. It is allowable for the crystalline fructose to contain 1 part per million of arsenic (by mass).

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#107

Post by redbeard0x0a » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:11 PM UTC

caseysoftware wrote: post #57

klenwell wrote: post #25

When Mr. Nutter was fighting the soda tax battle, he kept a bottle of Mountain Dew and a container with 17 teaspoons of sugar — the amount in the bottle — on the table in the center of his office. It was a good “conversation piece,” he said, about the surprising number of calories in a typical soda. I think this is key. Better information and transparency is having an effect. I'm glad to hear we're approaching a poin…

That's why we haven't had anyone start smoking in decades.. Soda sales are down but obesity is still up, so the calories are coming from somewhere. If you believe the other common stories, we're drinking the calories. I'd wager they come from the rise of coffee-based beverages - which would not be considered soda - but I don't have data to back that up.

All the extra weight is coming from the abundance of sugars that are added to food. Especially the low-fat or fat-free foods. So we aren't just drinking the sugar, we are eating it too.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#108

Post by nitrogen » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:15 PM UTC

kw71 wrote: post #81

neverartful wrote: post #53

Like many of the posters here, I realize that much of the food and drink sold is unhealthy. On the other hand, I don't think that nanny state regulations are the answer. Plenty of unhealthy things abound (when overused): chips, candy, pizza, fast food, cookies, ice cream, video games, television, etc. Maybe some of the same marketing tactics used to sell the unhealthy things can also be used to counter them with heal…

Under a socialized healthcare regime, every sick person is a problem for the whole society in that we have to pay for it. So, being careless with your health is a crime against the people. If you are in the USA, consider that you have been funding healthcare for some of the worst offenders for decades by paying taxes which fund hospitals. Now with the healthcare reforms in mind, which have itemized your contribution…

It's easy to advocate for collectivism when you think you are in the majority. I am a proponent of universal healthcare, but your comment has me reconsidering. Throwing individuals or subgroups under the bus so disdainfully is just as damaging to our social fabric as eating unhealthily, if not moreso.

We need to unify and enlighten ourselves, not look for more excuses to feel morally superior. So whatever solution we can find to obesity, it has to be one that uplifts, not one that alienates.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#109

Post by keithpeter » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:16 PM UTC

tdkl wrote: post #87

keithpeter wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm interested in the 20h to 12noon fast. Is that literally nill by mouth for that period or do you have a drink of water or unsweetened tea when getting up? I'd go for porridge at lunch on a regime like that. A younger colleague at work referred to porridge as 'warm icecream' the other day so there is hope I think.

Here's the best writeup on the topic I've found : http://antranik.org/intermittent-fasting/ The guy also makes great videos about bodyweight training, which I also implemented beside weights. I usually eat dinner before 20.00, but after that nothing. Water refreshes me in the morning (I stopped with coffee 2,5 years ago and am clean since), although as written in the article above coffee ain't that big deal either. T…

Interesting, thanks. I have never had sugary drinks, but I do tend to eat a lot of (whole) fruit which is still sugar.

Re: The Decline of ‘Big Soda’

#110

Post by yareally » Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 8:17 PM UTC

_delirium wrote: post #60

caseysoftware wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why we haven't had anyone start smoking in decades.. Soda sales are down but obesity is still up, so the calories are coming from somewhere. If you believe the other common stories, we're drinking the calories. I'd wager they come from the rise of coffee-based beverages - which would not be considered soda - but I don't have data to back that up.

For now I think Starbucks et al are benefiting from being culturally identified as more upper/middle-class. Obesity stereotypes seem to have fixated mostly on a "people of Walmart" type image of the fat, slobbish lower classes. So even though a 12-oz Starbucks caramel latte is far worse than a 12-oz Coke, it gets a pass.

I doubt many people drink something from Starbucks with or after every meal though. Also way more expensive to do so with Starbucks. 12 pack of name brand soda where I am sells for $3.00 during a typical sale.