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The model minority is losing patience

economist.com

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Re: The model minority is losing patience

#111

Post by xname »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #49
skywhopper wrote: post #35

I'm not sure what to think about this topic, but articles like this don't help me decide, when they do things like: * Dumping data from an advocacy group into a sidebar chart without doing any critical analysis of the data. The ratios of professionals to managers and executives are meaningless without factoring age cohort ratios into the data. * Comparing Asian student admission rates between Ivy League universities…

>* Implicitly accepting the idea that SAT or ACT scores are the only metric on which students ought to be judged for making admissions decisions. (Okay they mentioned "extracurriculars" and I was amused by the Northwestern person who said recruiters were looking for people who played lacrosse and rowed crew. But all the data mentioned were based on test scores alone.) What other metrics are you referring to besides a…

Exactly, those people want to imply asians are ONLY good at tests, but they have no data to back it up. The only thing they can say is: well, you know, there must be something wrong with aisans, ...

The easiest solution: use anonymous review process in college admission.

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#112

Post by jrochkind1 »

jessaustin wrote: post #100
jrochkind1 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the US (or it's colonial forebears) forcibly occupying the land occupied by others, or importing others as enslaved laborers -- was _driven_ by racism either, especially at it's origin. It was driven by economic profit, same as usual. Europeans didn't conquer the Americas because they hated Native Americans, they did it because they wanted the land and it's resources. They didn't import slaves, original…

Yes I agree with all of this. Your reference to the integration of the conquered reminds me of James C. Scott's studies of the states of Southeast Asia. As he explains it, the limiting factor on the wealth of kings was the number of subjects they had working the land. So when they went to war, it was primarily to capture more people they could enserf. There was actually a regular intergenerational cycle. Grandparents…

I love James C. Scott's writings too. :)

I am currently going through _Seeing Like a State_, going through it pretty slowly because nearly every page is so thought-provoking.

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#113

Post by xname »

rsy96 wrote: post #80

One reason that Asians outperform other racial groups in the United States is overlooked in the article: the difficulty of immigration. Most whites and blacks are born within the US, and Hispanics are either born or move into the US by simply crossing a land border. For Asians to come to the US, they have to cross the Pacific Ocean. In order to do that, they have to be either rich (at least middle class), highly educ…

You are talking about things you don't know. Many Asians came to the U.S. simply following their neighbors. Immigrant to developed countries is a cultural thing in many villages. Those people are just average farmers, not rich/middle class, not highly educated, not extremely adventurous or self motivating.

For example: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1635675...

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#114

Post by FlannelPancake »

gozo wrote: post #90
puredemo wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"All these Asian applicants look the same..." Seems to be her meta-message.

I'm not the one to defend Harvard, but an unestablished minority group only has so many opportunities so of course a lot of peoples resumes are going to look the same. That said, this is pretty much just traditional elitism. If your work harder than anyone else you'll still not get recognized because you're not claimed to be smart, cultured, pretty or interesting enough.

> If your work harder than anyone else you'll still not get recognized because you're not claimed to be smart, cultured, pretty or interesting enough.

Err, that's not at all what she said or even implied.

That's the point: they didn't work harder than anyone else applying to Harvard. They can't make decisions based on GPA/ACT/SAT scores, because everyone has the same top scores.

Hypothetically, and probably not that far off: So you have 10,000 applicants for a class of 2,000 and 8,000 of those applicants are valedictorians with extremely high SAT/ACT scores and they've managed to check all the regular boxes (played sports, instruments, etc.). How are you going to cull 6,000 applicants?

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#115

Post by FlannelPancake »

mildbow wrote: post #77
puredemo wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"All these Asian applicants look the same..." Seems to be her meta-message.

"All these Asians look the same..." Another win for casual racism. College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria. Because yeah, obviously human foibles always creep in.

> College admissions could really do with some sort of objective criteria

Like GPA and SAT/ACT scores? Because they tried that. Secondary education is too easy and variable in the US, and Harvard can't really do much about that.

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#116

Post by potatote »

mildbow wrote: post #89
nraynaud wrote: post #4

What's interesting to me too, is that they are also neglected in the discussion about diversity in tech. They are the most over represented minority in tech, and instead of looking into why, and how it happens, can we find a leverage for other minorities, what open them doors but not blacks and hispanics, they are just overlooked. Complaining people just overlook them as: "it's a bunch of white males", but Asians (an…

If I had to guess, I would say it's the cultural imperative of the family unit. One of the worst things slavery did, to african americans as a people, is to strip away their cultural meaning of family unit. I think it's on-par with the holocaust in terms of the human cost. Yes, there are a lot of other things, but not having a stable family unit while growing up messes up the next generation, perpetuating the cycle.…

Can you explain a bit more about what you mean by "cultural meaning of family unit"? How did slavery take away from the african americans?

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#117

Post by dnautics »

rsy96 wrote: post #80

One reason that Asians outperform other racial groups in the United States is overlooked in the article: the difficulty of immigration. Most whites and blacks are born within the US, and Hispanics are either born or move into the US by simply crossing a land border. For Asians to come to the US, they have to cross the Pacific Ocean. In order to do that, they have to be either rich (at least middle class), highly educ…

I'm a fifth generation Asian American and my family came to Hawaii as plantation workers, my father was the first in the family to go to college, and made captain in the US Navy. Ironically in his civilian (government) job his performance reviews can back as "no leadership potential" despite that in his military job he led the team that implemented the first digital inventory for the navy...

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#118

Post by czep »

golemotron wrote: post #95
chiaro wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's just a misunderstanding over the definition. Racism as a subject of study in the humanities refers to these societal power structures, and it was this definition and usage she was probably cleaving to. The world would definitely be a better if we didn't recognize labels, but since I kind of hit the trifecta as far as race, gender etc goes, I fit into society just fine. Those who feel marginalised by society fo…

It's very hard to believe that this redefinition of the word racism was done innocently. On its face racism is act of distinguishing people by race for favor or disfavor. When it is redefined as it has been in the humanities it leaves a vacuum. There's no longer a word for the concept that racism originally referred to.

Just because you learned of it just now doesn't make it a "re-definition". Who gave you the right to call your definition the real one?

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#119

Post by humanrebar »

protomyth wrote: post #20
lazyant wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit off-topic but on US tv shows is ridiculous how actors (esp. main characters) are usually white or black, little or no Asians and Hispanics. "Friday Night Lights" is about teenagers in Texas (1/3 pop. Hispanic) and they are all white or black (they even had an episode or more about the divide), not a single Hispanic or Asian ever (only one secondary character for a bit). EDIT: Also we laugh now at stereotypes li…

A Native American actor classmate of mine did a lot of tv during the era where Vietnam-based programs (e.g. China Beach) were running as casting directors would hire him for those parts (his hair was short then). I guess that's why you see self-financed stuff. Defiance has a Native American in a lead part, but I am hard pressed to think of anything else. Figure 2% of the population would give you something statistica…

Longmire has many Native American characters and addresses Native American and reservation issues throughout the series.

Re: The model minority is losing patience

#120

Post by humanrebar »

kenjackson wrote: post #109
lazyant wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit off-topic but on US tv shows is ridiculous how actors (esp. main characters) are usually white or black, little or no Asians and Hispanics. "Friday Night Lights" is about teenagers in Texas (1/3 pop. Hispanic) and they are all white or black (they even had an episode or more about the divide), not a single Hispanic or Asian ever (only one secondary character for a bit). EDIT: Also we laugh now at stereotypes li…

Best remedy -- watch shows with other minority actors. I watch Fresh of the Boat and just started watching Quantico, among other shows with non-traditional ethnic leads. And TV is one of the few places in society where its relatively easy to show your support for diversity.

> And TV is one of the few places in society where its relatively easy to show your support for diversity.

Sure. Except for religious diversity. I can't think of a TV show that touches religion with a ten foot pole.

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