The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out • Hacker News Board

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#31

Post by AnimalMuppet » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 7:41 PM UTC

kelvin0 wrote: post #29

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The police could well have been there because they had good reason to suspect that there was going to be trouble. > and there's a viable theory they were just waiting for an excuse But is there a viable theory that the police started the shooting? If you're going to start a shootout in town, and the police are there in force to try to stop that from happening, and you start a shootout anyway , and the police shoot yo…

Police acting as agent provocateurs is not new: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/quebec-police-admit-they-went-...

I get that. Is there evidence that the police were doing so in this case?

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#32

Post by RickHull » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 7:47 PM UTC

function_seven wrote: post #22

joeax wrote: post #12

“The city of Waco is looking at paying out hundreds of millions of dollars,” says Michael White, Wilson's attorney. This is the real problem. The police operate on a blank check principle and are held to zero accountability. The taxpayers are the real victims here.

> The police operate on a blank check principle and are held to zero accountability. The taxpayers are the real victims here. It's the taxpayers that are giving them that blank check in the first place. They're not victims, they're complicit.

Which taxpayers voted for the blank check?

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#33

Post by sandworm101 » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 7:58 PM UTC

>>Peterson signed all 177 of the so-called cookie-cutter probable-cause affidavits in bulk, without specifying the evidence against each individual defendant. Peterson, it turns out, is a former state trooper with no legal training.

Hate lawyers and law schools if you want, but they have their time and place. The problem here seams not that officers broke the law, but that they seem not to have any understanding of the law in the first place. Instead of planning and deliberation, they were all showboating against each other. The whole incident reads like a script for Lethal Weapon IV.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#34

Post by meatysnapper » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:00 PM UTC

I'd be very interested in the bullets recovered from the scene, but it sounds like that's not happening. The whole talk of long guns and a police trap sounds sadly totally expected with American police.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#35

Post by aianus » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:05 PM UTC

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #26

aianus wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who's going to supply us with drugs and prostitutes if not outlaws? It's the government legislation of morality that empowers outlaws and it will never end so long as human beings like to fuck and get high. Edit: s/causes these things/empowers outlaws/

Some of these gangs are doing human trafficking. If you think that laws against that are "legislating morality" rather than the only sane moral stand, then I don't even know how to begin having a conversation about ethics with you.

I doubt human trafficking would be competitive against legal brothels.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#36

Post by sandworm101 » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:17 PM UTC

jbob2000 wrote: post #2

Police say it's the bikers, bikers say it's the police. I don't trust either of them.

There are two clear groups (Police and Bikers) but also many subgroups. The bikers subdivide into three: Two gangs and a group consisting of several non-affiliated people. The Police seem to have a clear narrative. The other three groups present conflicting narratives. One might think that the clear narrative makes the most sense. To me it does not.

Given what happened (a chaotic firefight at a bar) I would expect a great many conflicting stories to emerge. That's what happens in chaotic situations. So the conflicting accounts from the various biker/bystander groups is in a way a confirmation of the events. It is the police's polished and consistent narrative that seems out of place.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#37

Post by douche » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:21 PM UTC

Are biker gangs on the rise following Sons of Anarchy, which depicted outlaw biker gangs in a semi-glorious(?) light, or are they just getting more media attention?

The Hell's Angels and such have been around forever, but I never much heard about them until a couple of years ago.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#38

Post by nosuchthing » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:30 PM UTC

nickbauman wrote: post #6

Gangs form around an economy. In the case of OMGs, the economy is drug and human trafficking, extortion, contract slaying and various other illicit businesses. Many OMGs are made up of a large percentage of ex military, with the USMC highly represented. Ditto for police forces, maybe not as much USMC. Considering how many soldiers we have, it's no surprise that OMGs are on the rise. You can thank the GWoT for that. T…

Read the article and you'll see it's more about the legal aspects of a situation where 177 people were indiscriminately sent to jail on rubber stamped charges.

Imagine being in an IRC channel with a 200 people and 10 of them got into a fight, presumably hacked each other, and than everyone in the channel is arrested on felony charges, and sent to jail with $100,000 bonds. Allegedly there may have been provocation and excessive weapons use by the police posing as members of rival groups.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#39

Post by WorkingDead » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:30 PM UTC

There was also a shooting at a Twin Peaks in Webster a few months later. Maybe 'Bike Night' doesn't promote a family friendly crowd. If breasteraunts want to gather these gangs up and feed them alcohol, they should be held partially responsible.

Re: The Texas Biker Gang Shoot-Out

#40

Post by nickbauman » Fri, Oct 02, 2015, 8:33 PM UTC

scott_karana wrote: post #9

nickbauman wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which means it was a turf war ultimately.

Did you read the article? It could just as well have been police-aggravated, or a combination of the two.

Do you live in this society? Why would anyone assume that the police are not part of a turf war? Police are a gang, too. They just have a government mandate.