Seems to me Atlassian "won" because they had a actual sales team not because of "technology".
People really seem to downplay this, but Atlassian's partner network of integrators and consultants is actually really powerful.
Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
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Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#12Jira certainly is more popular, but I never viewed the two products as being in direct competition. I don't know about the inner working and finances of Fogcreek, but given that Fogbugz is still around they've may have lost anything.
Pricing would certainly be a knob Fogcreek could tweak, if they believed that they where losing to Jira in some shape or form. Given that they haven't lowered prices or expanded their free tier sales of Fogbugz could be on the precise path that Fogcreek want for the product. Maybe their selling extremely well in a marked that most HN readers just aren't in contact with. A marked that doesn't mind the added cost.
It's different approaches to sales, make a little money from a large pool of customers, or sell a more expensive product/service to a smaller market. Both strategies are completely valid, but due to Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Uber and whatnot many will falsely assume that more customer is always better.
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#13There's an interesting discussion happening on Reddit involving ex-employees of both companies: https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/3n2sc1/why_fog...
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Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#14A big thing with the pricing... If I'm an individual contributor and want a bug tracker, I can drop 10 bucks on a JIRA license (out of pocket) or convince someone from management that I need it and that they need to pay for it.
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#15Yet FogBugz still feels way easier to use. Every time I'm in an Atlassian product, mainly Stash and JIRA, the UI sucks. I use them several times a week and still get lost. Maybe I'm dumb, but I don't seem to have this problem on other systems. But hey, at least JIRA isn't the craptastic laggy pos that is Podio. Certainly right that I've never seen FogBugz outside of myself or customers. Also, I think the name must hu…
I've used both, and I can only imagine your complaints about JIRA's UI are due to how it's been configured for your use. The out of the box user experience is the best I've seen for a web application. A robust yet easy to use 'search' feature is at the heart of many things, like the scrum and kanban boards, as well as widgets that can be put on your own personalize dashboard. You get a nice visual designer for settin…
> I've used both, and I can only imagine your complaints about JIRA's UI are due to how it's been configured for your use.
Exactly. There are some companies that go so overboard with Jira customizations that a single "create new issue" requires hitting page down three times to get to the end. And they arrive at that by adding a field here for the QA team, a field there for the Sales team...
In the end, you get a monster. New users will be exposed to that monster, not the vanilla Jira installation.
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#16And yet, "Creating a JIRA task is like going to the fucking DMV."
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#17On the other hand, I wish bitbucket were more popular compared to github. It doesn't seem like they invest much into bitbucket, as some silly issues have persisted for years. Have they given up?
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#18Yet FogBugz still feels way easier to use. Every time I'm in an Atlassian product, mainly Stash and JIRA, the UI sucks. I use them several times a week and still get lost. Maybe I'm dumb, but I don't seem to have this problem on other systems. But hey, at least JIRA isn't the craptastic laggy pos that is Podio. Certainly right that I've never seen FogBugz outside of myself or customers. Also, I think the name must hu…
I dunno, I had the opposite impression. I worked at a company from 2005-2007 that was evaluating FogBugz as a bugtracker, and found that (at least on Linux, which we were using) it was very unpolished. At the same time, some of our dependencies used Jira for their public issue tracker, and I recall looking at it and thinking it was the only bugtracker I'd actually like to use.
Nowadays I'd probably just use GitHub Issues - looking at Jira now it feels incredibly dated, but back then its only serious competitor was Trac. (Where is Trac, now, anyway? I haven't met someone who uses it in a while, but when I was founding my first startup in 2008 it was considered best-of-breed.)
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#19Yet FogBugz still feels way easier to use. Every time I'm in an Atlassian product, mainly Stash and JIRA, the UI sucks. I use them several times a week and still get lost. Maybe I'm dumb, but I don't seem to have this problem on other systems. But hey, at least JIRA isn't the craptastic laggy pos that is Podio. Certainly right that I've never seen FogBugz outside of myself or customers. Also, I think the name must hu…
I've used both, and I can only imagine your complaints about JIRA's UI are due to how it's been configured for your use. The out of the box user experience is the best I've seen for a web application. A robust yet easy to use 'search' feature is at the heart of many things, like the scrum and kanban boards, as well as widgets that can be put on your own personalize dashboard. You get a nice visual designer for settin…
Whoever designed JIRA's psuedo-markdown text format deserves a special place in hell.
Re: Why Fogbugz lost to Jira
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've used both, and I can only imagine your complaints about JIRA's UI are due to how it's been configured for your use. The out of the box user experience is the best I've seen for a web application. A robust yet easy to use 'search' feature is at the heart of many things, like the scrum and kanban boards, as well as widgets that can be put on your own personalize dashboard. You get a nice visual designer for settin…
Whoever designed JIRA's psuedo-markdown text format deserves a special place in hell.
The relevant XKCD: https://xkcd.com/277/