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American Nations Today (2013)

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Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#11

Post by protomyth »

"Of late, Far Westerners have focused their anger on the federal government, rather than their corporate masters."

The whole Far West part is a bunch of bunk and actually ignores quite a bit of history and settlement waves, but this line is the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Our corporate masters? I get the feeling the folks in "The Left Coast" have to deal with corporate masters a whole lot more than anyone in "The Far West". The thought that anti-federal feelings are anything new is just foolish, heck there have been historical articles posted on HN that point to the exact opposite.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#12

Post by SCAQTony »

joshAg wrote: post #10
SCAQTony wrote: post #2

Los Angeles is listed as part of "El Norte" which on their map is mostly all Mexico. That is absolute hyperbole. Though Los Angeles (GDP $800-billion) along with the rest of Southern California have a huge immigrant population the GDP of the area as a whole is well over $1-trillion. The cultures in Southern California and L.A. are remarkably diverse. To associate Southern California with nothing but Latino and Mexica…

I think you're overstating how much the author associates socal with only Latino and Mexican culture: "Before I describe the nations, I should underscore that my observations refer to the dominant culture, not the individual inhabitants, of each region. In every town, city, and state you’ll likely find a full range of political opinions and social preferences. Even in the reddest of red counties and bluest of blue on…

Thank you for the reminder. If culture framework is defined as traditions, value systems, myths and symbols that are common within a given society. (I cheated and looked it up) Then I double down on my opinion. ;-)

An interesting exercise I just did was to go to Google Maps and pick various locales in L.A, San Diego etc, and virtually "drive down the streets" and see if the cultural difference. The symbols and systems are definitely not consistent: YMMV :-)

Hollywood Blvd & Vine; Rodeo Drive, Beverly Hills; Van Nuys Blvd & Sepulveda (lot of pot shops) ; Gaslamp District San Diego, Huntington Beach, CA, Santa Monica, 4th street; Long Beach Harbor; Juarez, Mexico.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#13

Post by kemiller »

protomyth wrote: post #11

"Of late, Far Westerners have focused their anger on the federal government, rather than their corporate masters." The whole Far West part is a bunch of bunk and actually ignores quite a bit of history and settlement waves, but this line is the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Our corporate masters? I get the feeling the folks in "The Left Coast" have to deal with corporate masters a whole lot more than anyone in…

That's not what he's saying. He's saying they have disliked both from the beginning, but anti-govt sentiment predominates now. Which seems true as far as it goes.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#14

Post by protomyth »

kemiller wrote: post #13
protomyth wrote: post #11

"Of late, Far Westerners have focused their anger on the federal government, rather than their corporate masters." The whole Far West part is a bunch of bunk and actually ignores quite a bit of history and settlement waves, but this line is the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Our corporate masters? I get the feeling the folks in "The Left Coast" have to deal with corporate masters a whole lot more than anyone in…

That's not what he's saying. He's saying they have disliked both from the beginning, but anti-govt sentiment predominates now. Which seems true as far as it goes.

What I'm saying is that I have never heard this corporate master garbage. I know of a dislike for some farm companies but that is about the same degree other people complain about cell and cable companies. Anti-government sentiment was predominate in the old days, its nothing new.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#15

Post by thrownaway2424 »

protomyth wrote: post #14
kemiller wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not what he's saying. He's saying they have disliked both from the beginning, but anti-govt sentiment predominates now. Which seems true as far as it goes.

What I'm saying is that I have never heard this corporate master garbage. I know of a dislike for some farm companies but that is about the same degree other people complain about cell and cable companies. Anti-government sentiment was predominate in the old days, its nothing new.

Your own ignorance of history is on you alone. If you wish to relieve it you could research railroad settlement of the American West, specifically land grant subsidies thereof and abuse by the railroads of their power over settlers.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#16

Post by protomyth »

thrownaway2424 wrote: post #15
protomyth wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I'm saying is that I have never heard this corporate master garbage. I know of a dislike for some farm companies but that is about the same degree other people complain about cell and cable companies. Anti-government sentiment was predominate in the old days, its nothing new.

Your own ignorance of history is on you alone. If you wish to relieve it you could research railroad settlement of the American West, specifically land grant subsidies thereof and abuse by the railroads of their power over settlers.

The railroads screwed with everyone including the Left Coast, how is this unique to the section? Hell, some of the stuff they pulled on the east coast was pretty bad.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#17

Post by Expeditus419 »

learc83 wrote: post #8

For some reason they've split Metro Atlanta in two, which makes absolutely no sense. I move half a mile down the road, I'm in Greater Appalachia instead of the Deep South. People in Metro Atlanta don't identify with Appalachia more than they do with "The South", and the northern half of Metro Atlanta definitely didn't side with the Union in the Civil War (which is what the blurb about Greater Appalachia says). Obviou…

Any idea how this was actually mapped? It looks like census tracts.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#18

Post by douche »

Expeditus419 wrote: post #17
learc83 wrote: post #8

For some reason they've split Metro Atlanta in two, which makes absolutely no sense. I move half a mile down the road, I'm in Greater Appalachia instead of the Deep South. People in Metro Atlanta don't identify with Appalachia more than they do with "The South", and the northern half of Metro Atlanta definitely didn't side with the Union in the Civil War (which is what the blurb about Greater Appalachia says). Obviou…

Any idea how this was actually mapped? It looks like census tracts.

It appears to be broken down by counties, I assume. At least, those are the divisions in the New England states.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#19

Post by jessaustin »

Obviously there are numerous problems with this, but I'll just point out a couple. First, what is up with "Midlands"? Do we really see much commonality among Clayton NM, Aberdeen SD, Joliet IL, East Steubenville WV, and Baltimore MD? [For non-USAsians, these cities are nowhere near each other and are in no respect similar.] This looks like gerrymandering: something about these counties would have destroyed the narrative had they been included in adjacent Yankeedom, New Netherland, Tidewater, Greater Appalachia, El Norte, or Far West, so they weren't, because reasons. Unconvincing.

With respect to the other focus of TFA, violence, we see more of the same "ignore-all-nations-except-for-Northern-Europe-Japan-and-New-Zealand" crap that is typical in trendy "comparisons" of USA to "the rest of the world". The difference between USA and the short list of nations this sort of "analysis" deigns to consider is that USA is a nation of colonial origin. [EDIT: whoops... NZ is too.] Look at all other nations that were colonized, in Latin America and Africa. They all struggle with violence to an equal or greater extent than USA. Ahistoric pap like TFA perpetuates political bias more than it promotes understanding.

Re: American Nations Today (2013)

#20

Post by sdrothrock »

jessaustin wrote: post #19

Obviously there are numerous problems with this, but I'll just point out a couple. First, what is up with "Midlands"? Do we really see much commonality among Clayton NM, Aberdeen SD, Joliet IL, East Steubenville WV, and Baltimore MD? [For non-USAsians, these cities are nowhere near each other and are in no respect similar.] This looks like gerrymandering: something about these counties would have destroyed the narrat…

> USAsians

This is the most confusing new demonym I've seen in a while. As an Asian-American, it took me a moment to figure out why this would be knowledge only Asian-Americans would be expected to have.

Edit: It's not referring to Asian-Americans, by the way. It's apparently? (guessing from context) a new? way of referring to Americans, for some reason. I'm not really sure what's going on.

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