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I Have Read Prop F

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Re: I Have Read Prop F

#71
post #11
post #7

Wow: This is where it’s clear the authors overreached and created a toxic spill waiting to happen. If the City finds you did indeed host someone or assisted someone else as such, even for one night, then the City can take action against you. But then it gets absolutely bonkers. If you didn’t host anyone, or it was just your Aunt Rose visiting for the weekend, then your cranky neighbor can still sue you anyway, and th…

It's a bit overblown. Civil lawsuits cost money to prosecute, so they're unlikely to be pursued unless there's a good chance of winning.

Yes, but by setting a minimum damage amount of $250/night, you've removed the most difficult aspect of a case like this. It would be incredibly difficult to prove that a neighbor's having guest caused a high dollar amount of damages. Without needing to do that, all the person pursuing the case needs to show is that the law was violated and they'll be eligible for potentially thousands of dollars in damages. That creates a huge incentive to pursue cases like this, even when the damages sustained are negligible.

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#72
post #63

Edit: Thread parent lost due to moderator detach: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10281311 Houston also has four freakin' beltways (I610, TX 8, TX 6, and TX 99). Comparing a city that is the poster child for "sprawl" with a chunk of real estate that is more than a little landfill and locked on 3 sides with water is more than a little disingenuous. Houston's second beltway would encircle San Mateo, some of Oaklan…

The density of Brooklyn is almost double San Francisco, and I wouldn't consider Brooklyn a very high rise city.

You have it exactly backwards. The density of SF is almost double Brooklyn. 18k/mi^2 vs 10k/mi^2

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#73
post #46

It's really quite remarkable that you can know so little about something, yet be so judgmental about it at the same time. Go 'mericuh! Prop I is a temporary (18 month) moratorium in one neighborhood (the Mission), for only a limited subset of projects, coupled with the requirement that the city has to create a "neighborbood stabilization plan" by the end of that period [1]. It is not a "moratorium on building new mar…

You're characterizing opponents of Prop I as people who have only read the first chapter of an economics textbook, but the city's chief economist, who is well-respected, has a PhD in this, and has taught the subject as a professor at Berkeley, just finished a long, careful review of the proposition, and issued a scathing report concluding that it's a terrible idea.

http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/City-report-Missi...

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#74
post #20

AirBnB needs to step up and suggest what it thinks are some of the right ways to handle this. The fact is, many/most leases and HOAs forbid short term rentals, and for good reasons. As well, many areas are zoned non-commercial, again for good reasons. But people certainly should have some degree of autonomy when it comes to their personal property. The question is, what is it? What I never understood is why short ter…

There are already laws regarding any objectionable behavior that the AirBnB transient renters might engage in. If they are being loud and obnoxious and partying at illegal hours, call the cops and put in a noise complaint. If they are parked illegally, they can get ticketed by zealous meter-people like the rest of us.

Rental agreements often have clauses barring subletting. If you are a landlord and object to a tenant subletting on AirBnB, that's a violation of the terms of the lease, and you can threaten eviction. I would imagine it's obscenely Byzantine to actually get someone evicted, even with good cause and when they are in breach of contract in SF, though.

I'm glad I live in a relatively unregulated area where people mostly mind their own business and aren't jackasses.

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, California also interferes with the market to discourage selling real estate. Proposition 13 disconnected property tax rates from the value of the property (by capping the increase in assessed value at 2% per year, far below the increase in actual market value). Which created a massive incentive to hold real estate as long as possible without selling, since the only time the tax rate can reset to being bas…

This is true but in most cases it doesn't matter because your next best alternative is not changed. If you have owned a home for 10 years and want to buy a new home in another area, you will still want to sell your home. If you just moved to CA and want to own a home, you will still want to buy despite prop 13.

> If you have owned a home for 10 years and want to buy a new home in another area, you will still want to sell your home.

Actually, as an outsider looking in, the incentives seem set up such that you'd be far more inclined to rent your existing home than sell it.

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#76
post #63

Edit: Thread parent lost due to moderator detach: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10281311 Houston also has four freakin' beltways (I610, TX 8, TX 6, and TX 99). Comparing a city that is the poster child for "sprawl" with a chunk of real estate that is more than a little landfill and locked on 3 sides with water is more than a little disingenuous. Houston's second beltway would encircle San Mateo, some of Oaklan…

San Fransisco is no where near the top when you measure population density, other cities can fit more people in less space, San Francisco is not unique, it simply represents the failure of local laws. Also, what's with constant 'gub' slurs, are people on HN little children who must insult people who are willing to criticize inept policy makers?

> San Fransisco is no where near the top when you measure population density, other cities can fit more people in less space, San Francisco is not unique, it simply represents the failure of local laws.

Actually, you are factually wrong: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_b...

San Francisco is only behind New York, Los Angeles, and Miami in density. It's probably in or close to the top 20 in Europe.

Sure, none of our cities compares to anything in Asia. We also don't seem to like to live that dense.

> Also, what's with constant 'gub' slurs, are people on HN little children who must insult people who are willing to criticize inept policy makers?

Invoking a lack of regulations as proof of success when the factual metrics (Houston's population density is ridiculously, laughably low) easily refute said statement is going to provoke a response appropriate for someone who clearly is impervious to fact.

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#77
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The density of Brooklyn is almost double San Francisco, and I wouldn't consider Brooklyn a very high rise city.

You have it exactly backwards. The density of SF is almost double Brooklyn. 18k/mi^2 vs 10k/mi^2

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Re: I Have Read Prop F

#78
post #63

Edit: Thread parent lost due to moderator detach: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10281311 Houston also has four freakin' beltways (I610, TX 8, TX 6, and TX 99). Comparing a city that is the poster child for "sprawl" with a chunk of real estate that is more than a little landfill and locked on 3 sides with water is more than a little disingenuous. Houston's second beltway would encircle San Mateo, some of Oaklan…

The density of Brooklyn is almost double San Francisco, and I wouldn't consider Brooklyn a very high rise city.

> The density of Brooklyn is almost double San Francisco, and I wouldn't consider Brooklyn a very high rise city.

What are you smoking? I want some of that.

Brooklyn has a density of 35,369.1 people per square mile.

That would make it the 5th most dense city in the US. Behind only other New York areas. It would even put it in the top 10 in density for Europe.

What the hell DO you consider a dense city?

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#79
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more like being pro or con U2 or bee stings. How could you not have an opinion? Personally, I think AirBnB has not done a very good job helping communities figure out what the best situation should be. Many/most leases and HOAs forbid short-term leases for very good reason and yet AirBnB turns an eye. And for people who own their residences, many areas are zoned non-commercial, again for very good reasons, and A…

I find it very easy to not have an opinion. Whether my neighbor wants to rent out part of his property via airbnb, craigslist, or not at all makes no difference to me. It does not affect my quality of life, does not interfere with my enjoyment of my own property, and is a private transaction among 3 (or more) parties of which I am not one. I just don't care, at all. That doesn't mean that his tenants might not cause…

Some towns don't have noise ordinances. Thus, lets assume someone rents out their house. The renters hire a band with a powerful PA system, and play from dusk til dawn. How will you deal with the tenants? You have precisely zero recourse, because they aren't breaking any laws.

Isn't it obvious that these situations are far more likely to happen with short term tenancies than people who rent for a year, or own? It's similar to a mob mentality. "I'll be gone tomorrow." vs "I'll have to deal with my neighbors for the next X years".

These situations have unequivocally become more frequent as a direct result of the existence of Airbnb.

Having an opinion about a company that has streamlined the process for your neighbors to create unsafe or otherwise undesirable conditions in your neighborhood is pretty rational behavior, and not the exclusive domain of your fringe strawmen.

Re: I Have Read Prop F

#80
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The density of Brooklyn is almost double San Francisco, and I wouldn't consider Brooklyn a very high rise city.

You have it exactly backwards. The density of SF is almost double Brooklyn. 18k/mi^2 vs 10k/mi^2

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