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Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

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Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#311

Post by JoeAltmaier »

joe_the_user wrote: post #269
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was with you until that "twenty miles ... still wouldn't be possible." I ride my bike 20 miles to work frequently; its nowhere near as flat as Silicon Valley (Iowa is hilly). And the weather is often worse here. So maybe readjust 'not possible' up a notch or two?

Really, I meant say "no easy", in fact I did: When where one's work is twenty miles or more from one's living space, one just isn't going to easily bike to work. I slipped and said "not possible" later so jeesh, sorry. I meant "It's possible for it to be easy enough for the average person". I've commuted further distances myself but the average worker isn't going to do it. Sad but there you are.

True its a stretch. But compare an hour on a bike, vs an hour in traffic. It might be a wash.

As for the effort, the average person can do a whole lot more than they think. I ride with 20,000 Iowans in a weeklong 400+ mile ride every summer - aged 6 to 60 - 40 to 100 miles per day, pretty average people.

The only thing that makes the average person unable to do this is, they think they can't.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#312

Post by JoeAltmaier »

6t6t6 wrote: post #289
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess. But commuting may be the bulk of all bicycling I do. To do most of my bicycling on a crap bike would be very disappointing. I could also eat sawdust at work for lunch every day, if sawdust was nutritious. I don't need to eat tasty food. Nor wear comfortable clothes that fit - sackcloth will do. I'm happy to ride a really good bike. I want to be happy more often.

Well. Happiness is really a personal thing. In my case, it makes me happy to let my bike without any lock in front of my house, knowing that nobody will touch it. On the other hand, it would make me quite unhappy to get an expensive bike stolen. A carbon fiber bike would probably be 3 kilos lighter than my bike. But then I would have to carry a really heavy chain in order to lock it. So, I cannot see the gain. Also,…

Hm, no the point isn't utilitarian. Its joy, freedom, the feeling of flying down the lane on a beautiful day, stretching muscles.

My bike parks in the hall at work, no lock. So I guess I have the best of both worlds.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#313

Post by ptaipale »

jessaustin wrote: post #305
ptaipale wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never lived in American suburbia, so I never though ot this: the cul-de-sacs are made so that a bike or even a pedestrian can not get through? Over here (Finland), it is very common that a road is cul-de-sac for motor vehicles but you can get through riding bike or on foot. There is also a common traffic sign to indicate this, for instance here in my neighbourhood: https://www.google.fi/maps/@60.2285087,24.7129127,3a…

Over here (Finland), it is very common that a road is cul-de-sac for motor vehicles but you can get through riding bike or on foot. This is common in USA if the cul-de-sac is a retrofit to a previously-through road. (If not by design, then in the breach, because someone has knocked a hole in the fence and it hasn't been fixed.) However, in the sorts of housing-only developments that have culs-de-sac designed in, the…

Right, so the point is that property owners do not want to have anyone walk by on foot, because they fear they could be trespassers or loiterers that are not welcome in the area? And this is why a cul-de-sac stops not only cars but everything, with a fence.

But then that also stops e.g. children from moving about on their own in the neighbourhood.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#314

Post by nkassis »

kalleboo wrote: post #263
nkassis wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It seems people in the US fetishize road bikes with drop bars and skinny tires as the 'best and fastest' kind of bike" I don't think that true. The general opinion I've seen where I live is that bikes are toys and paying above a few hundred for one is ridiculous. I do agree that you probably don't want a race oriented road bike if your goal is to commute to work a few miles but if you enjoy the sport and know what y…

My perspective as a European is there seem to be two types. Whenever I bring up bike commutes with Americans, either the reaction is negative (with all the typical excuses), or their eyes light up and they start going on about that fixie they've had their eye on for so long. The "middle-class" of "bikes are fine tools for travel" just doesn't seem to be there - either you're dismissive or you're a "bike nut2.

Yeah that's pretty accurate from my experience too. It changes from city to city. Pacific north west cities like Portland and Seattle have a much more balanced view of cycling but on the east coast where I am now it's pretty much like you describe.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#315

Post by mcv »

Patrick_Devine wrote: post #233
nickbauman wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Minnesota it's common that suburban "subdivision" neighborhoods don't even have pedestrian sidewalks. And the inhabitants think that's a good thing. I cannot even.

I live in a neighborhood in Palo Alto that doesn't have sidewalks, and people here walk (and bike) all the time. The reason why it works is because many of the streets are extremely narrow, and we've worked fairly hard at making certain they aren't striped down the center. For whatever reason this seems to get motorists to drive more slowly and makes it safer for everyone.

In Amsterdam, bikes and cars are separated from each other wherever possible. That way, bikes can ride as recklessly as they like without endangering cars.

Bikes and pedestrians are harder to separate. Pedestrians can go everywhere, and especially tourists have a tendency to not watch out when they're crossing a bike path, or even stay on the bike path for no good reason.

The worst place is behind Central Station, where a heavy flow of pedestrians from the ferries and the station has to cross a continuous flow of bikes on the bike path, while bikes from the ferries try to merge into the already chaotic traffic. We really need a bridge or tunnel to keep bikes and pedestrians separate there.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#316

Post by dkhenry »

zurn wrote: post #304
rconti wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're welcome to your opinion. I bike 8 miles each way in Silicon Valley with a backpack on my back. I ride in a t-shirt and jeans (unless it's really hot, in which case I wear shorts). I ride moderately hard, so I arrive with a bit of sweat on my body and on my face. Sometimes I wipe the sweat off my face with a paper towel. 10 mins in my air-conditioned cube and I'm back to normal temp, all dried off, and merino t…

Just curious, why do you prefer a backpack to a pannier (or backpack-inside-pannier)?

I like the backpack better as I can bring it with me on the last 100 ft and into my building where I shower and change, where if its pannier's I either need a backpack inside of it, or I need to carry my stuff around.

Also people steal stuff, so I don't like leaving things on my bike.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#317

Post by npsimons »

sandworm101 wrote: post #129
TulliusCicero wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At the moment biking is dominated by young fit and generally healthy people. This is because our infrastructure sucks, so only young and fit people feel confident enough to bike around. In cities with high biking rates, that's not the case. Biking around for leisure is actually a stereotypical 'old person thing' in the Netherlands. > I see lots of young parents going to work by bike, but do they take their kids to…

It's more than the infrastructure, especially when it comes to schools. North America has a culture of selecting a child's schools from amongst many in a wide area. Not everyone sends their kids to a school a mile down the road, nor do all of their kids attend the same school at once. The getting hit is a problem. I don't know of any long-term riders in my city who haven't had violent confrontations with cars. There…

> had violent confrontations with cars.

If this happened between a motorist and pedestrian or even other motorist, what would happen? That's right, they'd take away their drivers license, which should be happening more often. This isn't a bike problem, not even sure why you brought it up.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#318

Post by mcv »

ptaipale wrote: post #294
joe_the_user wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing mysterious about the situation in silicon valley really. It's about space. Wikipedia tells me Copenhagen is 86.20 km [1] and San Jose is 466.109 km [2] but naturally silicon valley is several times larger than San Jose proper. If it was possible to just rent an apartment near where one worked, that wouldn't be an issue but we know how hard that is today. When where one's work is twenty miles or more f…

However, please do note that the Copenhagen city proper is geographically just a minor part of the metro area, and only about quarter of the metro population. The metro area is, as mentioned in your link, 2,778.3 km2, five times that of San Jose proper.

If you're going to compare metro areas, you should do the same for San Jose: 6,979 km2.

This is in fact even larger than the Randstad (4,300 km2). I'm not going to bike from Amsterdam to Rotterdam (in fact, I find that too far to commute no matter what method of transport I have). If the housing problem in Silicon Valley is really so big that it's hard to find a house within 10 km of the office, I can see how it's going to be hard to get people to commute by bike.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#319

Post by tmalsburg2 »

Natsu wrote: post #229
tmalsburg2 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it hilarious that Americans made it to the moon but think that commuting to work by bike is practically impossible. Meanwhile millions of people all over the rest of the world, from school children to seniors, are doing just that every single day. I moved to southern California last year (from the UK) and of course I ride my bike to work. My colleagues think that this is a really strange thing to do and some r…

Maybe for you, but I have been run over and otherwise injured while biking. The accident wasn't my fault, but I really don't like anything where my legs (and clothing) will suffer if I miss a single pothole. I do not enjoy it, either, not one iota. It was the only realistic option when I was a kid and even into college so I've done quite a lot of biking, but I got rid of the damn thing as soon as I could. I'd much ra…

Cycling in the US really is more dangerous than in Europe. I see two main reasons: 1.) Drivers are not aware of cyclists and don't know how to deal with them. When I cycle on roads with considerable car traffic, it regularly happens that cars drive dangerously close to me or that they cut me off. In Germany, drivers know what distance they should keep and to look for cyclists when turning. 2.) The condition of the streets is incredibly poor in the US. Potholes are a real problem, not just for cyclists. Some ptholes in San Diego are a foot deep and this is of course super dangerous for cyclists. I've never seen potholes like that in Germany.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#320

Post by loco5niner »

mcv wrote: post #315
Patrick_Devine wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a neighborhood in Palo Alto that doesn't have sidewalks, and people here walk (and bike) all the time. The reason why it works is because many of the streets are extremely narrow, and we've worked fairly hard at making certain they aren't striped down the center. For whatever reason this seems to get motorists to drive more slowly and makes it safer for everyone.

In Amsterdam, bikes and cars are separated from each other wherever possible. That way, bikes can ride as recklessly as they like without endangering cars. Bikes and pedestrians are harder to separate. Pedestrians can go everywhere, and especially tourists have a tendency to not watch out when they're crossing a bike path, or even stay on the bike path for no good reason. The worst place is behind Central Station, wh…

But then you'll need a separate path for everyone on roller skates.
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