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Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

thelongandshort.org

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Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#11

Post by copsarebastards »

RodericDay wrote: post #4
copsarebastards wrote: post #2

This brings up a number of problems with the current approaches to gathering signal from the noise of DNA, but it's making the deeper argument that DNA may not contain much useful information. I don't think it met the burden of proof for that argument. It's a popular argument: we want to believe that our attributes aren't predetermined, that we have free will, so we want to believe anything that downplays the role of…

> we want to believe that our attributes aren't predetermined, that we have free will, so we want to believe anything that downplays the role of nature in the nature vs. nurture debate Who wants to believe this? It seems pretty lop-sided to accuse the "nature"-skeptics (or "nurture"-proponents) of falling prey to confirmation bias, when our history is littered with much more evidence of the atrocities committed by eu…

> Who wants to believe this? It seems pretty lop-sided to accuse the "nature"-skeptics (or "nurture"-proponents) of falling prey to confirmation bias, when our history is littered with much more evidence of the atrocities committed by eugenicists.

Ugh, eugenicist atrocities have literally nothing to do with the science. Believing that nature is the leading cause of characteristics does not justify eugenics. And even if this did, how on earth does this disprove that nurture proponents are experiencing confirmation bias?

I'm not a nature proponent (or a nurture proponent). The fact that many nurture proponents experience confirmation doesn't prove them wrong; I'm merely saying that they're believing what they believe for the wrong reason.

> Even today, it seems that many people who are successful are desperate to find out how much it is their innate destiny, due to genetics.

This does not in any way disprove that some nurture proponents are experiencing confirmation bias.

Overall you've made this gigantic logical leap that because a small subset of nature proponents did bad things, nurture proponents must not be experiencing confirmation bias.

And before you make yet another logical leap and assume I'm talking about all or most nurture proponents experiencing confirmation bias, I'm not. I've said "we" to talk about a common human motivation, but I'm really talking about what I think the motivation of the author of the article is. I'm not making any claims about other people.

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#12

Post by devonEnlis »

zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

I think it's a complete tragedy that customers in the US can no longer get health information from 23andMe.

I started a genome software company that primarily targets the academic research market, but we recently adapted our software for 23andMe users: https://www.enlis.com/personal_edition.html

Happy to hear opinions and bug reports!

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#14

Post by sharvil »

devonEnlis wrote: post #12
zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

I think it's a complete tragedy that customers in the US can no longer get health information from 23andMe. I started a genome software company that primarily targets the academic research market, but we recently adapted our software for 23andMe users: https://www.enlis.com/personal_edition.html Happy to hear opinions and bug reports!

How does the report compare to the one generated by Promethease[1]? Promethease itself uses data from SNPedia[2]

[1] https://promethease.com/

[2] http://www.snpedia.com/index.php/Promethease

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#15

Post by jqm »

zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

While I somewhat agree people should be able to have their DNA tested freely if they so choose, perhaps these regulations are wiser than we are aware at the moment. Look at what people foolishly give Facebook. Will these same people be more careful with their DNA information? Will this information be used against them at some point in the future? Just something to consider.

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#16

Post by JoeAltmaier »

jqm wrote: post #15
zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

While I somewhat agree people should be able to have their DNA tested freely if they so choose, perhaps these regulations are wiser than we are aware at the moment. Look at what people foolishly give Facebook. Will these same people be more careful with their DNA information? Will this information be used against them at some point in the future? Just something to consider.

Anybody who finds a flake of your skin can have your DNA pattern; its not going to be something that can be kept secret. We'll have to learn to live in this brave new world, with such wonders in it.

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#17

Post by kolev »

devonEnlis wrote: post #12
zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

I think it's a complete tragedy that customers in the US can no longer get health information from 23andMe. I started a genome software company that primarily targets the academic research market, but we recently adapted our software for 23andMe users: https://www.enlis.com/personal_edition.html Happy to hear opinions and bug reports!

Any idea where I can get a full sequencing at a reasonable price for personal use?

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#18

Post by Evenjos »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #10
zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

I'm sure you appreciate the other side of that argument – that organisations should not be able to advertise medical devices and services without demonstrating that the results are accurate. The idea that a medical services company and an individual consumer are on the same footing doesn't carry much weight for me. One of the obvious solutions is for a state body to set a standard for what accuracy is required in ord…

The FDA implied that the tests are inaccurate. Where's their evidence?

They have no oversight--they are the oversight. That is a problem. They can claim anything, and use it as an excuse to add arbitrary regulations and rules that have an end result of pleasing lobbyists or voters or the latest celebrity-politician.

Re: Genomics and me: DNA testing may not reveal as much about yourself as you'd hope

#19

Post by Evenjos »

DenisM wrote: post #8
zeveb wrote: post #6

> Two years ago, US consumers could see more than 240 detailed health and trait reports, including risk factors for heart attack and type 2 diabetes. Then, at the end of 2013, the Food and Drug Administration clamped down. They implied that 23andMe's tests were inaccurate. They also worried that some consumers would misconstrue the risks, seeking out unnecessary treatments and changing their medication regimes withou…

The business of the state is to prevent false advertising, because it deprives the citizens of making informed decisions, and because it awards financial resources to those who are willing to profit by harming others. It happens so that for health-related issues the bar for false advertising is higher than the for other products. I think it's for a good reason. The authority to set the bar was given to the FDA by the…

The FDA started out with the best of intentions--to stop snake oil peddlers or food vendors who sold fatal concoctions as "delicious" or "miracle cures."

23andMe is not selling any drug. The FDA is now in the business of regulating information that goes to the consumer. And the FDA has increasing power with no oversight. Potentially life-saving medicines have to jump through decades of clinical trials before they can be used to save lives.

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