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Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

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Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#141

Post by TulliusCicero »

brlewis wrote: post #134
TulliusCicero wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, it's something Google would really love to see. You have to remember that as the Goliath in the room, Google has to be somewhat careful about how hard they try to persuade local governments, as many residents already dislike how quickly they've grown and how that's contributed to rents going up and traffic getting worse. And Google has made a bunch of improvements themselves, like, I believe, the buffered bike…

as many residents already dislike...rents going up and traffic getting worse Those sound like good reasons for local residents to support more nearby housing.

Yup, and thankfully the outgoing NIMBY city council members got replaced last fall with ones that have a more urbanist leaning, and they're moving ahead of housing in North Bayshore now. I just wish it was more than ~5,000 units; that's not very much compared to how many people work there.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#142

Post by jkyle »

superuser2 wrote: post #127
lambda wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not about replacing cars with bikes, but making biking a viable alternative, such that it is actually possible to get from point A to point B by bike without taking a substantial risk of being killed by substantially faster car traffic. No one actually expects to replace all cars with bikes. But replacing 20% of them would substantially cut down on congestion and emissions; and avoiding further growth in auto…

>but making biking a viable alternative I think the (well-founded) concern is that this expenditure of political capital means mass transit may not get the attention it deserves. Public transit can be ridden by anyone; bicycles are only useful to the able-bodied.

Bikes also alleviate congestion on public transit and roads.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#143

Post by plonh »

gozo wrote: post #59
DannyBee wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They tried, multiple times, and were explicitly rebuked http://www.mv-voice.com/print/story/2012/07/13/google-housin... http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/26/technology/google-plans-ne... etc It comes up every few years.

While I think the situation is ridiculous, I also can't help thinking that if you're one of the most successful companies in the world and you can't get this done. It's either not that great of priority for you or you're doing something wrong.

When you can't persuade a small town city council, it is because you aren't doing enough bribery. Maybe that is wrong.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#144

Post by TulliusCicero »

sandworm101 wrote: post #135
TulliusCicero wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, the idea is not to switch ALL driving to biking. That would be silly. The idea is to support and encourage biking where it makes sense. If you're doing short or medium-distance trips where you have limited cargo, biking can work very well, better than cars, both for the individual and for society at large. But only if we build our transportation infrastructure such that biking isn't dangerous.

But if the promotion of biking comes at the expensive of those who cannot bike (via transit/driving taxes etc) then the situation may occur where the disabled and elderly are in fact financing the biking lifestyle of the able-bodied. We are nowhere near this now, but if say 75% of people started commuting via bike the other 25 might wind up paying for the infrastructure. So there is both an infrastructure and taxbase…

I don't disagree, but even the bike capitals of the world of Amsterdam and Copenhagen don't have bike rates that high. They're more in the 33-50% range depending on which area you're looking at.

I agree that we also need strong transit. I wish we could get a real subway around these parts.

I'd also like to reiterate that in these bike-friendly countries, many elderly actually still bike. In fact, instead of looking at it as something that doesn't account for their hypothetical bad health, you can look at biking as something that supports their health being good as long as possible. Part of why America is so fat is likely because of how car-dominant we are.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#145

Post by lisa_henderson »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #71
mc32 wrote: post #64

To my mind, one of the main issues, in addition to protected bike lanes is the spread. Bike friendly cities are more compact. Commuting to work via bike is not a strenuous fifteen mile commute one way. They tend to be leisurely few mile rides. Now, not to say it's not possible, but a one to five mile bike ride is not the same as a ten to fifteen or more miles bike ride. Now, I do like Copenhagen's above ground bike r…

Sure, you're never going to get people who live 15 or 20 miles out biking the whole way to work, but there's lots of people who live You also have to keep in mind biking as a first-mile/last-mile complement to rail transit. If there's good bike paths to get to a transit station, that effectively extends the usable radius of the station. Already, lots of people bike to Caltrain and then bike from their stop to work (I…

About this:

"but there's lots of people who live Then the headline should be "Google wants to make biking easier in Silicon Valley". The comparison to Copenhagen simply doesn't make sense. Riding a bicycle to work is an activity that is practical in denser areas, not in historically suburban valley.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#146

Post by gangstead »

sliverstorm wrote: post #108
buro9 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure, you're never going to get people who live 15 or 20 miles out biking the whole way to work That's what I do every day in London. Why wouldn't you? Myself and a lot of my friends choose our housing approx' 45 minutes to an hour away from the centre of London just to ensure we've got a good ride every day. At a commuter average of 16mph, and an experienced cyclist average of 18/19mph means that 15 to 20 miles is…

Many, many people: - do not have showers at work - do not have safe routes to ride - are not experienced cyclists - average more like 10mph The discussion is not "how do we get hardcore bike nuts to ride to work". That's not hard.

With the exception of showers and possibly safe routes these problems are addressed by experience. Cycling is not something it takes years to be an expert at or gain fitness in. Biking to work once or twice a week for a month and you'll no longer be going 10 mph and you know what to look for in a route and you'll notice more route options as you get a chance to explore.

Experience can even over come the shower issue. As your fitness level increases you won't have to exert yourself so much and you can also figure out creative to freshen up to an acceptable smell level (i.e. a "sinker")

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#147

Post by gozo »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #136
gozo wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was more thinking of compromising. Making deals is, at least to some extent, what business is about and I don't see the differences as insurmountable. Maybe Google don't play nice with others, but there's firms that do that too in exchange for money.

From what I can tell, Google plays as nice as humanly possible, there were just a lot of NIMBYs in the Mountain View city council until recently who hated the idea of getting housing in that area. But the NIMBYs lost badly last fall, and now the city actually is moving forward with housing in North Bayshore. I just wish they were moving forward with more (I think right now the plan is like ~5,000 units). See: http://…

My observation would be that relationships are not Google strong suit. They don't really do customers or enterprise. Support has been lacking for a long time. They are not even that good at managing their brand considering their popularity. Maybe they will get their way eventually, but I think people are going to be disappointing in a decade or so. It's supposedly the technology capital of the world and deserves a greater outcome then what a few companies can push through a dysfunctional process.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#148

Post by Thlom »

buro9 wrote: post #82
TulliusCicero wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, you're never going to get people who live 15 or 20 miles out biking the whole way to work, but there's lots of people who live You also have to keep in mind biking as a first-mile/last-mile complement to rail transit. If there's good bike paths to get to a transit station, that effectively extends the usable radius of the station. Already, lots of people bike to Caltrain and then bike from their stop to work (I…

> Sure, you're never going to get people who live 15 or 20 miles out biking the whole way to work That's what I do every day in London. Why wouldn't you? Myself and a lot of my friends choose our housing approx' 45 minutes to an hour away from the centre of London just to ensure we've got a good ride every day. At a commuter average of 16mph, and an experienced cyclist average of 18/19mph means that 15 to 20 miles is…

Most people don't want their daily commute to be a workout.

Re: Google Wants to Make Silicon Valley as Bike-Friendly as Copenhagen

#150

Post by brlewis »

sandworm101 wrote: post #111

I do laugh at the image of society at large switching from cars to bikes. At the moment biking is dominated by young fit and generally healthy people. That may be silicon valley but it isn't the general population. I see lots of young parents going to work by bike, but do they take their kids to school on bikes? Does grandma get to the doctor on a tricycle? And what about the growing number of people who need to be b…

What population dominates biking depends where you are. I share my mixed train/bike commute mostly with middle-aged commuters, but that's just the demographic of where I live (Boston North Shore).
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