Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Importance of Donald Trump

nymag.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 141 posts

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#61

Post by lsc »

[deleted] wrote: post #45
lsc wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Despite what media wants people to believe, may are sick and tired of political correctness and bending down to everyone's demands for anything. If you are an average straight white man, yeah, it sure looks like things aren't getting better. Your wages haven't increased much at all (adjusted for inflation) since the '70s. And yeah, women and the gays and men who aren't white (though, I think it's mostly women; there…

[deleted]

I was able to understand that you were offended by my post, which is fine, but if I am to take it as a wake-up call, I am going to need to understand why you found it offensive.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#62

Post by [deleted] »

Synaesthesia wrote: post #39
hkmurakami wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same sex couple rights and and women's rights are, while not world-leading, ahead of many countries.

But by social standards America is not liberal at all. Labor laws are very pro-business, very few labourers are unionized, and education costs are very high and health costs are way higher than other 1st world countries, despite spending as much or more on it. There is no real labour party or left leaning party.

[deleted]

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#63

Post by alkonaut »

jrcii wrote: post #60
alkonaut wrote: post #54

This is the core paragraph of this article: The best news about Trump is that he is wreaking this havoc on the status quo while having no chance of ascending to the presidency. You can’t win the Electoral College in 2016 by driving away women, Hispanics, blacks, and Asian-Americans, no matter how large the margins you pile up in deep-red states. This whole clown show lets people express their dissatisfaction with the…

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/28/donald-trump... http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/09/21/donald-trum... The idea that all minorities hate him probably sits well with your wishes and that of the author of the article but it's not necessarily true.

I don't believe he's hated by women/minority voters, but he doesn't have the support needed to win the presidency, and he certainly appears to do everything he can to reduce that support.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#64

Post by yk »

Dan Carlin proposed the theory that Trump understood that only trying to win the GOP primary is a winning strategy for the primary.[0] Basically the primary caucus is a lot more radical than the general electorate and normal candidates have to run on a just a little bit more conservative platform than the next leading candidate, while preparing to turn around as soon as they have secured the nomination. A candidate like Trump can run on a platform that is much better suited for the primary election, because he is not planning to win the presidential election.

As an outside observer ( I am German), I think that the theory sounds interesting. However, it is possible that he tries a different maneuver to win the general election. His refusal to found a PAC may mean, that he plans to run on an anti-corruption, Washington outsider platform and basically form a analogous coalition as Syriza did in Greece. Syriza's coalition partner is a right wing populist party, they basically formed a anybody but the old boys club coalition. And my guess is, that assuming Hillary wins the Democratic nomination, there are quite a few moderates who find such a candidate attractive, even if he is a reality TV star.

[0] http://www.dancarlin.com/product/common-sense-295-trumping-t...

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#65

Post by camelite »

lsc wrote: post #48
camelite wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google 'trump polls women'. Then reassess.

yeah, and I see a lot of references to how well he does among "GOP women" or women who vote republican already. That's a rather different sort, I think. (interestingly, I see a bunch of references to the idea that a reasonably large percentage of women identify as democrats.)

Still, a sizable number of women, correct? Do you agree they might already know they're people too, and like Trump for reasons other than "white rage" or being expected to treat women and minorities decently?

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#66

Post by JonnieCache »

emp_zealoth wrote: post #51
lsc wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Despite what media wants people to believe, may are sick and tired of political correctness and bending down to everyone's demands for anything. If you are an average straight white man, yeah, it sure looks like things aren't getting better. Your wages haven't increased much at all (adjusted for inflation) since the '70s. And yeah, women and the gays and men who aren't white (though, I think it's mostly women; there…

The issue is,you cant call rape a rape anymore, unless its drunk man having a sex with an equally drunk woman - then its PATRIARCHAL RAPE You cant even have a hard discussion without gagging one side. Its wrong. While republicans are pretty much cancer, the left seems growing incapable of dealing with reality,because it might offend someone

>The issue is,you cant call rape a rape anymore, unless its drunk man having a sex with an equally drunk woman - then its PATRIARCHAL RAPE

What does this mean, is it irony?

UK person here, genuinely confused.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#67

Post by rustynails »

hkmurakami wrote: post #31
ant6n wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"(...) liberals and minorities, who also feel (...) america is actually not liberal enough" Are you serious? America is basically a conservative, corrupt dystopia.

Same sex couple rights and and women's rights are, while not world-leading, ahead of many countries.

Speaking of political correctness, who do people tolerate women's rights? It's just another excuse for sexism. I support the rights of all people (which encapsulates men and women). If you want a level playing field, you have to think beyond gender, skin colour, sexual orientation, etc. when we stop terms like women's rights, I know we've progressed beyond political correctness. I can't wait for that day.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#68

Post by rustynails »

dennisnedry wrote: post #58
Frondo wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I know, the political correctness police don't actually send anyone to forced labor camps, because, of course, no such thing exists. As for being harassed or chased, again, it seems like, if there's any merit to that accusation of harassment or "chasing," the beleaguered not-politically-correct victims of that could, you know, call the cops or file a restraining order or whatever. Those are actual real-worl…

Here's an example of the "political correct police" - Twitter shaming. Somebody says something satirical and they are assigned a "label". This was the case with Justine Sacco. Jerry Seinfeld and Chris Rock refuse to perform at universities, citing that the students there "can't take a joke due to political correctness". There isn't a regulating force in the USA for being PC; however, there are social ramifications th…

Or, watch the Google Science Fair awards for 2015. The Bolivian teacher that won an award said she supported "girls", I assumed it was a girls school until i saw a glimpse of a boy momentarily. No one blinked an eye, but my first thought was "how do those poor boys feel being ostracised like that, especially when it's done on purpose". That's political correctness says it's fine to discriminate against boys. Thankfully, other than one slip up by a Google employee (who corrected herself quickly), it was well balanced across genders and nationalities.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#69

Post by lsc »

camelite wrote: post #65
lsc wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah, and I see a lot of references to how well he does among "GOP women" or women who vote republican already. That's a rather different sort, I think. (interestingly, I see a bunch of references to the idea that a reasonably large percentage of women identify as democrats.)

Still, a sizable number of women, correct? Do you agree they might already know they're people too, and like Trump for reasons other than "white rage" or being expected to treat women and minorities decently?

sure, that's possible. I'm just going off what I've seen of Trump. It smells a lot like identity/race politics to me. but if your point is that Trump might be deeper than he appears on the surface and I simply haven't done enough research, you very well could be correct; I haven't done a whole lot of research.

One direction I could take my argument is to suggest that race politics goes deeper than economics, and that women can be racist, too.

Another direction, is this idea of "identity politics" - this idea that if I see myself as the sort of person who votes for Trump for social or self-image reasons, that overrides any self-interest I may personally have in the matter, and maybe even what I think is right and just.

but... talking about identity politics is hard, because it quickly becomes circular. If you believe it because your group believes it, why does your group believe it?

I'm particularly poorly placed to understand identity politics in a respectful way, because part of my self-image is that I am the sort of person who doesn't pretend to agree with my friends; the sort of person who has friends who are different, who have different opinions. I mean, I'm sure this self-image is as flawed as anyone else's self-image, and you could poke holes in it all day, but this is my self image, and so the very idea of liking something because the group I identify with likes it seems... negative, perhaps in the same way that immigration seems negative to the trump voter.

Re: The Importance of Donald Trump

#70

Post by bruceb »

alkonaut wrote: post #63
jrcii wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/28/donald-trump... http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/09/21/donald-trum... The idea that all minorities hate him probably sits well with your wishes and that of the author of the article but it's not necessarily true.

I don't believe he's hated by women/minority voters, but he doesn't have the support needed to win the presidency, and he certainly appears to do everything he can to reduce that support.

Hispanics and Asians are generally in non competitive states CA and TX come to mind. Who says this? Nate Cohn:

"This idea may seem jarring, given that Mitt Romney took just 27 percent of the Hispanic vote in his 2012 loss to Mr. Obama, according to the exit polls, while George W. Bush won about 40 percent in his 2004 victory. But in 2016 Hispanics will represent just 12 percent of eligible voters, and between 9 and 10 percent of actual voters. That’s a lot, but it’s not large enough to grant or deny Republicans the presidency.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/21/upshot/hispanic-voters-are...

Not an an endorsement of candidate or party but simply pointing out mis-information by special interest groups.

Post reply on HN