Live data from Hacker News

Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

cell.com

41–50 of 63 posts

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#41
post #9

I started meditating about 2 years ago because I liked the idea of having better 'control of my mind' - at the time I thought it was a gimmick but to my surprise it actually works. To begin with I found that after 20-30mins of closing my eyes and trying to think of nothing, I always came out of the session feeling a lot calmer. Fast forward to today and I can now isolate thoughts and throw them away if they are garba…

I don't remember how I started with meditation, but it was working in data entry that prepared me for it. Figuring out how to speed up my typing led me to the realization of how the mind is just layers of processes, and how training through repetition is just a matter of setting up a cue/response behavior in sub-conscious processes. Which can be physical (training to hit a baseball or ride a bike) but can just as easily be mental (training to become calm on cue).

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#43
I thought this paper was fascinating! Here is my brief summary of this paper.

This paper is discussing meditation in a fairly broad sense, which includes practices related to eastern religions (Buddhism, Hindu), abrahamic religions (Christianity, Judaism, and Islam), as well as modern practices found in a modern clinical setting (CBT).

They propose a classification of meditation practices. At the top level, there are three types of meditation: (1) Attentive Meditation, (2) Constructive Meditation, and (3)Deconstructive Meditation.

Attentive meditation has to do with controlling ones focus. These practices generally have the practitioner intentionally narrow or broaden their focus. Zen breath counting and body scanning meditation are examples of Attentive meditation.

Constructive meditation practices aim to create and strengthen healthy habits, or commitments to certain values. This could involve imagining what it's like to be others, or imagining yourself as an embodiment of certain values. Constructive practices may also have the practitioner contemplate their own mortality, so that they can consider what is truly important in life. Christians praying to God for strength and thinking about their immortal soul are examples of Constructive meditation.

Deconstructive meditation practices aim to foster insight into the perceptions, emotions, and cognition of the practitioner. Self-inquiry and contemplation on these objects themselves are often a part of this type of practice. CBT and other modern clinical techniques are examples of Deconstructive meditation.

------------------------------------

A couple other notes:

* All three types of meditation seem to be useful in different ways. * It's uncertain to what extent do the effects of specific meditations rest on the frameworks, beliefs, and world views that underlie these practices.

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#44
post #35
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting. What timespan did you need to start seeing good results? Are you still improving after 2 years?

@amelius It's been in my experience "results" vary widely with a lot of people. Part of the reason is that calmness is not the ultimate aim of meditation, but rather, a side-effect. For some people, the practice of meditation will quickly surface up a lot of anxiety and existential issues. It won't feel calm at all. Having been lured into thinking calmness is the end-goal, meditation is written off as "not working",…

Thank you so much for your writing on this issue. I second others' motion that you should write a book, but until you do, what book would you recommend for someone who wants to get started?

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#45
If you're curious about current scientific research around Meditation, check out the Advances in Meditation Research conference at Sloan Kettering Cancer Center in NYC (http://meditation2015.com/) The one in 2013 had many great talks and interesting findings (like meditation causes "wakefulness" instead of helping you sleep).

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#46
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

@amelius It's been in my experience "results" vary widely with a lot of people. Part of the reason is that calmness is not the ultimate aim of meditation, but rather, a side-effect. For some people, the practice of meditation will quickly surface up a lot of anxiety and existential issues. It won't feel calm at all. Having been lured into thinking calmness is the end-goal, meditation is written off as "not working",…

Thank you so much for your writing on this issue. I second others' motion that you should write a book, but until you do, what book would you recommend for someone who wants to get started?

I usually give out book recommendations based on the person's interest. So I'll give my best shot for making a generic recommendation.

The first thing to understand is that books on meditation are not going to help you all that much. This is not something you try to understand intellectually. It is experiential. You are much better off attempting to practice. If you need help with practice, there are various groups and flavors of mindfulness meditation: vipassana, zen, insight, etc. There's going to be a flavor, and a group of people with whom it will feel right.

Barring that, hacker_9's suggestion of the Meditation sub-reddit is not bad. My suggestion though is to ignore the people talking about theory -- practice, find people who practice, and allow the issues and observations to surface up from there. It's a kind of empirical inquiry into yourself where you drive the discussion through your observations, rather than the other way around.

Now having said that, the most generic book on helping you practice meditation that I recommend is Mindfulness in Plain English. You can find this for free online.

I have also heard about Calm and Headspace apps and knew people who tried it. They are probably not a bad way to start -- though like all things, it comes and goes, and there will come a time to drop it and move on.

Traditional Buddhist teachings don't necessarily get into the psychological aspects of it. Or let me be more precise: the psychological descriptions don't seem to resonate well with Westerners, and is typically dismissed as part of empty ceremonies, or pre-modern descriptions of psychology. (For example: what does the Padme Family or the element of Air have anything to do with your day-to-day life?)

So a meditation practice can be paired with therapy, and will work very well if the therapist also practices.

That leads to the other book I would recommend, since people are interested in healing their neurotic patterns. There is a great book whose technique complements mindfulness meditation: Tsultrim Allione's "Feeding Your Demons: Ancient Wisdom for Resolving Inner Conflict". This book distilled out an older practice in a way that combines with gestalt therapy and presented in a way that is much more accessible for people who grew up in the West. Like the tradition it comes from, although the full method uses visualization methods, it ends with mindfulness meditation. Along with a regular practice of meditation, it's a great way to deliberately gain some insight into your subconscious.

Hope that helps.

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#47
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can really nix unhappy thoughts? How can I do this too?

It's not really about nixing unhappy thoughts. A lot of people misunderstand that as the purpose of meditation. It's possible to get into bliss states through some form of concentration exercises, and among my friends, we call them bliss junkies. Rather, it's the avoidance of unhappy emotions and thoughts that create distortions, leading to neurotic emotional and mental patterns. These emotions and thoughts will aris…

Can you say a bit more about the illusion part?

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#48
As someone who has done some meditation and spent some time as a Buddhist monk, I find this scientific treatment of the subject very interesting. When I was in the robe we meditated a lot under the guidance of senior monks who were very accomplished. Other forms of meditation were only mentioned in passing. I've heard many incomplete descriptions of the differences between various types of meditation and wondered if there was a good taxonomy somewhere.

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#49
post #3

Why do people do all these strange things? To make more money with "better brain" ?

To be happy. I don't do meditation (and in fact get kind of irritated that practitioners of it seem to imply the only way to get in more control of your brain is through meditation), but I practice CBT. The idea is to be in greater control of your conscious and subconscious processes by being more aware of what's going on in your brain. For example, I noticed that when people make suggestions on products I work on th…

"I was able to identify the emotions that rush over me when that happened. Then, I was able to notice and acknowledge those emotions happening and finally I was able to control them and let them pass without influencing my behavior."

That is precisely one of the central practices in the meditation practice I am familiar with.

Re: Cognitive mechanisms in meditation practice

#50
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can really nix unhappy thoughts? How can I do this too?

It's not really about nixing unhappy thoughts. A lot of people misunderstand that as the purpose of meditation. It's possible to get into bliss states through some form of concentration exercises, and among my friends, we call them bliss junkies. Rather, it's the avoidance of unhappy emotions and thoughts that create distortions, leading to neurotic emotional and mental patterns. These emotions and thoughts will aris…

What do you mean by "bliss states"?
Post reply on HN