A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees • Hacker News Board

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#11

Post by generic_user » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:04 PM UTC

There is a coordinated media attempt across the EU to spin positive 'messaging' onto the refugee crisis. But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. The EU has been exposed once again as an incompetent overreaching poorly though dangerously romantic mistake.

Continuous failures of ECB policy, the collapse of Greece under the EURO, the PIGS in serious trouble, add a totally uncontrolled mass refugee crisis, the entire EU project looks like an incompetent bureaucratic mess.

The damage is so great that Even China and Russia have managed to claim the moral high ground and quit rightly blame the crisis on the EU itself and NATO adventurism in Syria.

I do not think rehashing WW2 German collective guilt as a media spectacle is going to change the perceptions of anyone paying attention to this horrible situation.

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#12

Post by scotty79 » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:04 PM UTC

danbruc wrote: post #5

jkot wrote: post #2

Lovely, Germany invites people, but demands other countries to take care of their guests. Social support for immigrants in Germany is higher then median salary in many EU regions.

If you become unemployed in Germany you get unemployment benefits depending on your previous salary for one year I think. After that you get social benefits based on the existential minimum, roughly 400,- Euro plus your actual rent and you can request additional support for special circumstances like getting a baby. And because this is defined as the existential minimum refugees receive the same. Not sure what you me…

So he's right that social support for immigrants (and other jobless people in Germany) is higher than median (even average) salary in some regions of EU?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#13

Post by leaveyou » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:10 PM UTC

weland wrote: post #3

jkot wrote: post #2

Lovely, Germany invites people, but demands other countries to take care of their guests. Social support for immigrants in Germany is higher then median salary in many EU regions.

Outrageous that they'd bring European solidarity into this. /s

If Germany wanted to really help those refugees as it pretends then it should have allocated X millions of euros from its budget and should have sent humanitarian aid in Turkey where these immigrants are living currently. Encouraging those immigrants to continue to trample all the borders and countries between Turkey and Germany at great risk of dying on the road and complete chaos, is not a wise thing to do if Germany really cared about "european solidarity".

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#14

Post by tiatia » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:11 PM UTC

danbruc wrote: post #5

jkot wrote: post #2

Lovely, Germany invites people, but demands other countries to take care of their guests. Social support for immigrants in Germany is higher then median salary in many EU regions.

If you become unemployed in Germany you get unemployment benefits depending on your previous salary for one year I think. After that you get social benefits based on the existential minimum, roughly 400,- Euro plus your actual rent and you can request additional support for special circumstances like getting a baby. And because this is defined as the existential minimum refugees receive the same. Not sure what you me…

400,- Euro plus your actual rent, plus free health insurance plus some other benefits. A value of around 1000 Euro. Working for 40 hours per week for 10 Euro (above the minumum wage) gets you 1600 Euro before taxes. After taxes you are close to the 1000 Euro you get for free. For 70-80% of the world population this sounds too good to be true.

The Germans lost their minds...

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#15

Post by quonn » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:12 PM UTC

scotty79 wrote: post #12

danbruc wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you become unemployed in Germany you get unemployment benefits depending on your previous salary for one year I think. After that you get social benefits based on the existential minimum, roughly 400,- Euro plus your actual rent and you can request additional support for special circumstances like getting a baby. And because this is defined as the existential minimum refugees receive the same. Not sure what you me…

So he's right that social support for immigrants (and other jobless people in Germany) is higher than median (even average) salary in some regions of EU? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...

Clearly almost all countries have far higher averages. Also, the immigrants have to live in Germany, where the cost of living is much higher than the parts of Europe with a low salary.

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#16

Post by mahouse » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:12 PM UTC

generic_user wrote: post #11

There is a coordinated media attempt across the EU to spin positive 'messaging' onto the refugee crisis. But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. The EU has been exposed once again as an incompetent overreaching poorly though dangerously romantic mistake. Continuous failures of ECB policy, the collapse of Greece under the EURO, the PIGS in serious tr…

What I don't understand is why us Europeans have to pay for the adventurism of the NATO; I wish all the refugees moved to Israel and the US, to be honest.

Once again Putin is right, and this uncovers how a permanent conflict at the arab world is in the interest of the NATO and the US/Israel-aligned world overall.

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#17

Post by chvid » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:16 PM UTC

generic_user wrote: post #11

There is a coordinated media attempt across the EU to spin positive 'messaging' onto the refugee crisis. But make no mistake this is a total disaster for the refugees, member state Citizens and the EU bureaucracy. The EU has been exposed once again as an incompetent overreaching poorly though dangerously romantic mistake. Continuous failures of ECB policy, the collapse of Greece under the EURO, the PIGS in serious tr…

How is it coordinated?

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#18

Post by generic_user » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:16 PM UTC

moe wrote: post #9

leaveyou wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are lying at "Third". Angela Merkel publicly encouraged immigrants to come (and die trying) by promising that Germany will host all the people who arrive in Germany and several days later when the reported numbers of immigrants became alarming, Germany and France announced "a plan" (IMPOSSED behind scenes) to distribute the immigrants to other EU states because "solidarity and bla bla bla". That is extremely unfa…

Angela Merkel publicly encouraged immigrants to come Bullshit.

The EU has been encouraging migration for years for there supposed 'demographic crisis'. This is reported on regally in the press if you care to research.

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#19

Post by jpfr » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:16 PM UTC

onli wrote: post #4

jkot wrote: post #2

Lovely, Germany invites people, but demands other countries to take care of their guests. Social support for immigrants in Germany is higher then median salary in many EU regions.

That is not true. First, Germany has a problem with social support even for Germans, Hartz 4 is horribly low and injust. Financial social support is one of the problems currently with the immigrants: It is basically non-existant. No EU region has a lower median salary than this. Second, Immigrants are not guests, they are immigrants or fugitives, and possibly supposed to stay. Third, Germany demands nothing new from…

> First, Germany has a problem with social support even for Germans, Hartz 4 is horribly low and injust.

Hartz 4 (long-term unemplyment aid) is basically what the country can sustainably pay without getting into the same debt spiral of Greece, etc. It's enough to survive, but not much more.

> Financial social support is one of the problems currently with the immigrants: It is basically non-existant. No EU region has a lower median salary than this.

During the processing of their asyl request, immigrants get money for housing, food, basic medical services and 140 Euro/month for leisure. Once their asyl request is accepted, they are entitled to the same social aid as any German. But you need to see money in context. Other European countries have a much lower cost of living.

> Second, Immigrants are not guests, they are immigrants or fugitives, and possibly supposed to stay.

Immigrants who are not fleeing from a humanitarian crisis get denied asyl and are expelled.

Re: A 22-year-old anti-Nazi song tops German charts again – to welcome refugees

#20

Post by quonn » Sat, Sep 05, 2015, 12:18 PM UTC

tiatia wrote: post #14

danbruc wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you become unemployed in Germany you get unemployment benefits depending on your previous salary for one year I think. After that you get social benefits based on the existential minimum, roughly 400,- Euro plus your actual rent and you can request additional support for special circumstances like getting a baby. And because this is defined as the existential minimum refugees receive the same. Not sure what you me…

400,- Euro plus your actual rent, plus free health insurance plus some other benefits. A value of around 1000 Euro. Working for 40 hours per week for 10 Euro (above the minumum wage) gets you 1600 Euro before taxes. After taxes you are close to the 1000 Euro you get for free. For 70-80% of the world population this sounds too good to be true. The Germans lost their minds...

> For 70-80% of the world population this sounds too good to be true.

Not sure what you're getting at here. For most of the world population the situation in _any_ rich country sounds too good to be true.

The fact is that these people are mostly refugees and they come because of unbearable situations at home, war, etc. _If_ they come to Germany, we will make sure that they can get access to health care, for the same reasons we make sure our fellow unemployed citizens also get access. Nothing wrong with that.