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Petition UK government to not ban encryption

petition.parliament.uk

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Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#71

Post by u02sgb »

jdimov9 wrote: post #68

There shouldn't be a need for any petition. A government with the illusion that it can "ban encryption" has already lost all authority and credibility, so should not be governing anyone.

Says somebody with a technical understanding of encryption. The problem is there's a lack of understanding in this area and the headlines play well to the media.

I think this is important and have emailed two friends (a doctor and a lawyer) to ask them to sign it. I described it as:

'It may be similar to how you feel when you watch a B movie lawyer or doctor "making a professional decision". The only difference being I'm watching the people who are running this country.'

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#72

Post by DanBC »

ocb wrote: post #70
Joeboy wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why you think that. Perhaps I was unclear. The average prospective terrorist / criminal etc isn't going to be able to set up TLS. If they encrypt their communications, the odds are it's going to be going via a third party. Next time you send an email, tell the recipient that from now on you're going to communicate directly by TLS, and they'll need to set up a server before you can talk to them again. I b…

Using PGP securely is as easy as downloading some software, typing in your message, and clicking a button. It's not something that requires any knowledge beyond basic computer usage. You aren't going to be able to stop people from sharing PGP software on the internet. I think you're severely underestimating the intelligence of people in general. If we're talking about ISIS, all it takes is one moderately experienced…

> Using PGP securely is as easy as downloading some software, typing in your message, and clicking a button. It's not something that requires any knowledge beyond basic computer usage. You aren't going to be able to stop people from sharing PGP software on the internet.

And yet we find a bunch of supposedly encrypted stuff where the user did something wrong, leaving the stuff effectively unencrypted.

See also people uploading keys to github etc.

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#73

Post by tired_man »

How does anyone think that a petition to a government will cause that body to change their direction on any topic other than meaningless feel good areas?

Serious policy isn't influenced by petitions. If you don't have a majority of legislators/MPs in your pocket, you're wasting both time and bandwidth.

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#74

Post by sorokod »

cm2187 wrote: post #69
sorokod wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't see how, without any context, you can say that "Webmails, social medias or dating services are of a much greater interest to a nosy government". As to regulations, if it is the law that backdoors are mandatory, then banks have no say in this.

Because they are services hosted outside the UK and which are not heavily regulated. Banks not only provide everything the gvt asks but actually have a duty to act as a law enforcement agency, i.e. watching their customers on the gvt behalf. Facebook or Gmail aren't required to do that.

You seem to imply that currently (retail? investment?) banks in UK are obligated to provide the government with information regarding customer's accounts. Can you provide a reference?

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#75

Post by redblacktree »

redblacktree wrote: post #42

What is the enforcement plan for this? Will people be taken to jail for sending encrypted communication? How will messaging be differentiated from banking? (if those who claim a more limited scope are correct) The whole plan just seems unworkable.

Would the downvoter please explain? I am genuinely curious about how this could be enforced.

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#76

Post by [deleted] »

pjc50 wrote: post #36

http://www.revk.uk/2015/07/crypto-wars.html "If a British citizen with an iPhone purchased in France and roaming in Germany iMessages a Chinese citizen roaming in Sweden using an iPhone purchased in Denmark, which government's keys need to be inserted in the iMessage communications by an American company (Apple) legally based in Luxembourg using servers hosted in Eire?"

[deleted]

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#77

Post by Joeboy »

LunaSea wrote: post #66
Joeboy wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why you think that. Perhaps I was unclear. The average prospective terrorist / criminal etc isn't going to be able to set up TLS. If they encrypt their communications, the odds are it's going to be going via a third party. Next time you send an email, tell the recipient that from now on you're going to communicate directly by TLS, and they'll need to set up a server before you can talk to them again. I b…

TLS is currently simply a matter of point and click on a graphical interface. For hosting provider setup, to domain name registration and TSL certificate generation there are thousands of online tutorials. You don't need to be an expert or a developer to know how to setup TLS on a Wordpress blog.

A Wordpress blog run by a third party does not constitute a secure messaging system, even if you have TLS enabled on it. And it's still a lot less easy than using WhatsApp.

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#78

Post by throwaway7767 »

iamcurious wrote: post #26

I think we are fighting the wrong battle here. The power equation is already in favor of the government snooping everybody, making it law only puts things in the open. We should fight in that direction, making it so that everything is more transparent. Wanna have my data? Okay, but I want to have yours. I specially want to have all the data about what you do with my data. I want to be able to request all the data you…

Presumably the people fighting this battle value their privacy. How would their fight benefit from switching to fighting against privacy?

I think your goals are completely orthogonal to the people who made and signed this petition, so your suggestion is unlikely to sway anyone.

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#79

Post by sillygeese »

So let's see..

Governments are passing increasingly Orwellian laws, obviously against our wishes. They clearly don't want us to have any privacy whatsoever, and are basically just making that a legal reality too. Hello police state.

In response, people ask governments to stop stripping away their privacy.

How would you expect governments to respond, besides with some PR-bullshit to placate us or give us a false sense of security. "We would never read the contents of your messages, only the metadata! Honest!".. and people buy that as if they didn't know governments lie to us all the fucking time.

Imagine a King telling his subjects he'll raise taxes until the economy implodes. The subjects ask him nicely to please not raise taxes quite that much.

What does the King do? -Whatever the fuck he damn well pleases, as long as people aren't willing to risk their lives in de-throning him. Of course, after a revolution, a new King is throned, because THIS time it'll be different!

This is so fucking insane.. When will people wake up?

Re: Petition UK government to not ban encryption

#80

Post by Cakez0r »

untog wrote: post #16

Urgh. This should be better phrased. From the BoingBoing article: David Cameron says there should be no "means of communication" which "we cannot read" It's very specific to communication, and reading between the lines, messaging, as opposed to something like HTTP communication between a bank and a customer. Don't get me wrong, it's still incredibly stupid, but the government will be able to reply to this petition wi…

What if the communications are being sent over HTTPS? E.G. facebook messenger
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