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The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

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Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#351

Post by robgibbons »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #350
robgibbons wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You, sir, are moralizing just as much as anyone else. This situation is not ethically clean-cut, despite how badly you want it to be. The website's existence itself is -- at the very best -- ethically and morally questionable. The hack, while technically illegal, is arguably a morally righteous act. You can't say that there is nothing ethically acceptable about sharing this data, when its very existence is ethically…

"The website's existence itself is -- at the very best -- ethically and morally questionable". I vehemently disagree with this statement. Why is it morally and ethically questionable to facilitate private individuals finding sexual partners? Perhaps it's questionable according to your moral code, but society is not run on your personal moral code, thankfully

Luckily, most of the entire human race agrees with me.

Maybe you don't think it's inherently unethical to cheat on your partner. But it is certainly an act of questionable morality. In fact, it is literally illegal in many states: "Adultery isn't just a crime in the eyes of your spouse. In 21 states, cheating in a marriage is against the law, punishable by a fine or even jail time."

You, and all of the other moral relativists can tell me I'm an extremist, or a purist, but basically I just believe in justice. You cheat, you deserve to get caught. You run a site for cheaters, you deserve to get hacked.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#352

Post by paulhauggis »

I'm actually happy this happened.

When the private conversation of Donald Sterling was leaked..it didn't matter..because morally, he did something wrong and needed to have everything taken away from him.

When it was leaked that the Mozilla CEO donated a small amount of money to a cause that angered the left, it didn't matter how we got the information. He was bullied online (and offline) until he resigned.

When Wikileaks leaked the locations of covert soldiers in foreign countries, we had many people here on HN saying it doesn't matter if they even get killed..they shouldn't have been there in the first place. I was down voted and silenced for saying anything contrary to this or even having an opinion on it that didn't fit the narrative.

But somehow, because it probably effects people here on HN (and cheating isn't really a problem), it draws the line.

So, to me, this is justice. If you cheat and don't use a fake name...and your spouse/boss/newspapers/family find out that you are on this list. It's your own fault and you deserve what you get.

Let this be a lesson to you all: You should protect the rights of everyone, even if you don't agree with what they are saying. Otherwise, people like me won't protect your rights when the same thing happens to you.

If want the bullying to stop for being gay...it's a little absurd that a person with a different set of religious beliefs than your own deserves to get bullied in the same way (and it's justified).

In fact, I might just make a website that utilizes all of the data and cross-references Facebook, family, friends, etc...or a bot that automatically contacts them. To make it easier to find out if your spouse is cheating. It's similar to how the GNU uses the existing system to promote freedom.

This should bring about a discussion about privacy and why bullying someone online and destroying personal lives (or firing someone) for a person's lifestyle or opinions is not good for society and is wrong.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#353

Post by smtddr »

Lawtonfogle wrote: post #291
ZoFreX wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to this poster: https://www.reddit.com/r/lgbt/comments/3ebzzj/i_may_get_ston... there is not a requirement to be in a relationship to use the site. And now he might die, because of the leak.

>And now he might die, because of the leak. Isn't this akin to blaming Snowden/Manning for diplomatic fallout instead of blaming those who were engaging in the wrongful practices that led to the fallout.

FYI, for others reading this comment: The wrongful practice implied here is the stoning, not being gay. Took me awhile to figure that out. I almost went on a rant.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#354

Post by vasilipupkin »

robgibbons wrote: post #351
vasilipupkin wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The website's existence itself is -- at the very best -- ethically and morally questionable". I vehemently disagree with this statement. Why is it morally and ethically questionable to facilitate private individuals finding sexual partners? Perhaps it's questionable according to your moral code, but society is not run on your personal moral code, thankfully

Luckily, most of the entire human race agrees with me. Maybe you don't think it's inherently unethical to cheat on your partner. But it is certainly an act of questionable morality. In fact, it is literally illegal in many states: "Adultery isn't just a crime in the eyes of your spouse. In 21 states, cheating in a marriage is against the law, punishable by a fine or even jail time." You, and all of the other moral re…

human race used to agree on a lot of things we find incorrect today, so that's a pretty weak argument.

But that aside, does it ? Do most people agree that the website shouldn't exist ?

Anal sex was illegal in some states up until recently, that doesn't mean it's a good idea for it to be illegal

The website doesn't force you to cheat on your partner, you could for example, let your partner know you are on it. Some people on it are in sexless marriages, for example

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#355

Post by inversionOf »

RodericDay wrote: post #316
robgibbons wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You, sir, are moralizing just as much as anyone else. This situation is not ethically clean-cut, despite how badly you want it to be. The website's existence itself is -- at the very best -- ethically and morally questionable. The hack, while technically illegal, is arguably a morally righteous act. You can't say that there is nothing ethically acceptable about sharing this data, when its very existence is ethically…

It's honestly pretty bizarre to have a giant moralizing post about how people should not moralize. I'm glad at least some people pick up on the hypocritical irony.

tptacek is like some sort of HN version of famous (note that his post was so important that his friend dang moved it from a completely different thread from many hours earlier), and I swear that the vast majority of his posts would wallow in light grays if his name wasn't attached.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#356

Post by JoeAltmaier »

robgibbons wrote: post #351
vasilipupkin wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The website's existence itself is -- at the very best -- ethically and morally questionable". I vehemently disagree with this statement. Why is it morally and ethically questionable to facilitate private individuals finding sexual partners? Perhaps it's questionable according to your moral code, but society is not run on your personal moral code, thankfully

Luckily, most of the entire human race agrees with me. Maybe you don't think it's inherently unethical to cheat on your partner. But it is certainly an act of questionable morality. In fact, it is literally illegal in many states: "Adultery isn't just a crime in the eyes of your spouse. In 21 states, cheating in a marriage is against the law, punishable by a fine or even jail time." You, and all of the other moral re…

So the hack was wrong in the remaining 29 states? Sounds like moral relativism right there.

In the US, justice must be pursued by legal means, else there's no case. These hackers just removed any chance of prosecution in the 21 states, because of tainted discovery.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#357

Post by Lawtonfogle »

harryf wrote: post #181
dgfv1 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry what does that article have anything to do with anything. And if some wacko kills his family and himself how is that in any way my fault?

You took it upon yourself to interfere with other people's relationships and families. Whatever moral reasons you feel justify your anonymous intervention, when you start fucking with other people's relationships and families you have no idea of what's going to happen. A struggling young couple with a small child - the type of "hint" you provided might tip one or both parents over the edge... You have no idea. In sho…

Does this not apply to anything you send? Say you send a message that one spouse is involved in some illegal behavior. What if reporting child abuse results in the same outcome? The whole 'you could push them over the edge' can be applied to quite a lot of warnings to give a parent.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#358

Post by Lawtonfogle »

in3d wrote: post #93

I'm not sure if people realize how significant this hack is. We just might have seen the first public hack that will cause people to die or be physically hurt. Homosexuality is illegal in certain countries (like Saudi Arabia) and this hack might expose people to harm in these countries. Some reactions of spouses might also be violent. It looks like the reaction of most commenters is very different compared to when Ga…

>Homosexuality is illegal in certain countries (like Saudi Arabia) and this hack might expose people to harm in these countries.

To me this is the same logic as saying that Manning/Snowden brought people to harm. Now if you already agree with that, no problem, but I wonder about people who follow this line of reasoning for this release but not for the Manning/Snowden releases.

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#359

Post by Lawtonfogle »

nicolas_t wrote: post #217

What is worrying about this is that some people are in real physical danger because of this leak. It probably seemed like fun and "social justice" for the hackers but it's not. There are people who live in countries where adultery is punishable by death. Likewise for being gay. There's already one person from Saudi Arabia who expressed his concerns on Reddit but there's likely to be a lot of other people affected. An…

>What is worrying about this is that some people are in real physical danger because of this leak.

Everytime Tor is compromised, not matter how bad the people being hunted down, do we not risk the same thing happening to innocent people caught up (say government dissidents in certain countries)? Every time someone finds a way to break encryption and uses it to hunt down someone instead of immediately patching it, don't we run the risk of people who, by our own morals, are innocent being hurt if not killed?

Re: The Ashley Madison Database Was Leaked

#360

Post by probably_wrong »

bdavisx wrote: post #258
dsacco wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great comment, Thomas. I had an argument with my girlfriend about this. No matter what reasoning I used, no matter what I said, she could not agree that it was wrong that Ashley Madison (A.M.) was hacked. Her position was that marital infidelity is such a pubishable offense that the participants on A.M. deserve to be publicly outed. In her view, it was not even up for debate. She felt so powerfully about in…

I wonder how she would feel if she was addicted to narcotics, went to NarcAnon and then had her name published when someone leaked/hacked their database because "those people shouldn't have done drugs in the first place". Or replace NA with AA.

I think there's a small but important difference. The hack would be closer to someone revealing the list of customers of whoever gave her the narcotics. They did not reveal the identity of those trying to fix their issues, like AA/NA would be.

Or, to put it the other way around, they revealed the database of the cheating site, not the patient list of the marriage counselor.

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