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Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

blogs.windows.com

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Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#131

Post by slowmovintarget »

teekert wrote: post #97
tigeba wrote: post #3

When they released this a couple of months ago I was pretty excited to try it out. I think the barrier to installation is a bit high. First install Windows 10, then custom install of VS, install IoT Templates, then about 30 more steps before you get the image to flash on your SD. How about a link to the image I can blast on the SD and kick the tires without a couple hours of downloading and installing prerequisites?

Very funny considering the uneasiness people have towards "putting Linux on a computer". For the Raspberry Pi, the reality is completely reversed as NOOBS is the absolute easiest, most convenient way to put any OS on any computer ever. I really don't understand people who want this, with closed source software the learning stops at some point, you can't learn everything about your Windows-Pi even though it was create…

I read the headline, considered it for a few moments, and the only response I could come up with was "No."

Why would I put an OS on a computationally constrained device that is essentially guaranteed to spend a portion of the CPU time doing things I likely don't want done, for someone else (Microsoft in this case)?

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#132

Post by nadams »

bborud wrote: post #113
tigeba wrote: post #3

When they released this a couple of months ago I was pretty excited to try it out. I think the barrier to installation is a bit high. First install Windows 10, then custom install of VS, install IoT Templates, then about 30 more steps before you get the image to flash on your SD. How about a link to the image I can blast on the SD and kick the tires without a couple hours of downloading and installing prerequisites?

Business as usual for Microsoft. There must be something about their business model I'm not getting. Going to microsoft.com with the intent of buying Windows to install it on a naked PC or in a VM on OSX, I have yet to identify an option that allows me to: 1) buy a license, 2) download an ISO image. The closest solution I've seen is to download some exe file that presupposes that I have Windows installed somewhere so…

> The closest solution I've seen is to download some exe file that presupposes that I have Windows installed somewhere so I can...

My guess they did that because it's probably just like BartPE or other PE products - it copies files from the underlying OS.

> Is it really so horrible to sell their product to someone who wants to run their OS under VMWare?

There is nothing stopping you from running Windows in a VM - millions of people do it all over the world.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#133

Post by lawl »

voltagex_ wrote: post #130
lawl wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quickly made an unpacker script in bash, couldn't test it yet, but it looks like it works. You'll need 7zip and a working installation of python, https://github.com/lawl/Win10IOTRaspberryUnpacker

https://github.com/lawl/Win10IOTRaspberryUnpacker/blob/maste... ?

It was in the repo I got the ffu2img script from, forgot to remove it, see https://github.com/t0x0/random

Fixed now, thanks.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#134

Post by throwawaykf05 »

teekert wrote: post #97
tigeba wrote: post #3

When they released this a couple of months ago I was pretty excited to try it out. I think the barrier to installation is a bit high. First install Windows 10, then custom install of VS, install IoT Templates, then about 30 more steps before you get the image to flash on your SD. How about a link to the image I can blast on the SD and kick the tires without a couple hours of downloading and installing prerequisites?

Very funny considering the uneasiness people have towards "putting Linux on a computer". For the Raspberry Pi, the reality is completely reversed as NOOBS is the absolute easiest, most convenient way to put any OS on any computer ever. I really don't understand people who want this, with closed source software the learning stops at some point, you can't learn everything about your Windows-Pi even though it was create…

I've spent a decade and a half developing software for and deploying software to Linux, but never had to look at the code. Funnily enough, that's the same number of times I've had to look at the code for Windows and OSX, which I've been using for a comparable amount of time.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#135

Post by nadams »

christoph wrote: post #115
bborud wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Business as usual for Microsoft. There must be something about their business model I'm not getting. Going to microsoft.com with the intent of buying Windows to install it on a naked PC or in a VM on OSX, I have yet to identify an option that allows me to: 1) buy a license, 2) download an ISO image. The closest solution I've seen is to download some exe file that presupposes that I have Windows installed somewhere so…

I suffered this with a 2nd hand Windows 7 computer my mother was using that kept complaining about being counterfeit. Windows is only £80 or so and there was a big button on the nag screens that took me to the Windows site to buy a licence. Great - credit card in hand I clicked on through and was instantly greeted with buy Windows 8.1 screens. The problem is, I absolutely did not want under any circumstances to insta…

> I suffered this with a 2nd hand Windows 7 computer my mother was using that kept complaining about being counterfeit.

That has been known to happen [1] (it's never happened to me personally). I suspect it has something to do with buggy AV or anti-malware software.

> For nearly 1 hour I tried to find a way to buy that Windows 7 licence key and found absolutely no way to do it.

You don't have a Best Buy type store near you?

[1] http://www.infoworld.com/article/2859267/operating-systems/w...

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#136

Post by throwawaykf05 »

tpio wrote: post #99
thenewwazoo wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not. MS makes really, really killer tools.

On a really, really shitty platform without a package manager and a decent CLI.

I've done barely any MS development to speak of. However, I have done extensive development using CLI-based tools and I've used excellent IDEs like Jetbrains'. The power a good, integrated tool gives you over less integrated environments is tremendous. I rarely need the CLI anymore for development, so maybe with good enough tooling it doesn't matter.

Now, I hear MS' tools compare favorably with Jetbrains'. If that's true, that sounds like a pretty decent platform to me.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#137

Post by WorldWideWayne »

s73v3r wrote: post #114
cobalt wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you can in VS 2015

You cannot write Android apps in Java in VS 2015, which is the vast majority of apps. You can do some NDK stuff in C/C++.

VS 2015 has Tools for Apache Cordova. That's what integrates with the emulator. You can build apps with Ionic and other PhoneGap/Cordova frameworks.

Of course, one can also use Xamarin. I doubt they'll try to compete with the tools for Java.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#138

Post by joezydeco »

david-given wrote: post #100
joezydeco wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd recommend Yocto to build a system and toolchain for your target, but it's insanely painful to do anything beyond building a precooked recipe for a known embedded target. Installing an ARM toolchain is simple now. Don't build one unless you really need to (or you install Yocto). apt-get install gcc-arm-linux-gnueabi

There's a page on my website called 'A short guide to building a gcc cross-compiler (while still remaining nominally insane)'. It's hopelessly out-of-date now, but it's still one of the most popular pages I've got. Back when I wrote it, in the gcc 4.3.3 days, I don't even think gcc had a release manager --- we're talking clean, out-of-the-box build failures here. It's gotten a bit better since then, but getting hold…

It's gotten a bit better since then, but getting hold of a gcc cross-compiler is still painfully, pointlessly hard

For ARM it takes 90 seconds in Debian/Ubuntu. I posted the command right above.

And the larger chipmakers will provide or point you to relevant toolsets or include them with their IDEs. Even the large independent IDE makers wrap their stuff around gcc now.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#139

Post by teekert »

throwawaykf05 wrote: post #134
teekert wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very funny considering the uneasiness people have towards "putting Linux on a computer". For the Raspberry Pi, the reality is completely reversed as NOOBS is the absolute easiest, most convenient way to put any OS on any computer ever. I really don't understand people who want this, with closed source software the learning stops at some point, you can't learn everything about your Windows-Pi even though it was create…

I've spent a decade and a half developing software for and deploying software to Linux, but never had to look at the code. Funnily enough, that's the same number of times I've had to look at the code for Windows and OSX, which I've been using for a comparable amount of time.

I'm not talking about "developing for" I'm talking about "learning about." I have learned a lot about hardware using Gentoo, compiling my own kernel. If I wanted to I could look at the source code. I also never did, like you, I'm just saying there may be youngsters out there who would.

Re: Windows 10 IoT Core for Raspberry Pi 2

#140

Post by teekert »

nbadg wrote: post #107
teekert wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very funny considering the uneasiness people have towards "putting Linux on a computer". For the Raspberry Pi, the reality is completely reversed as NOOBS is the absolute easiest, most convenient way to put any OS on any computer ever. I really don't understand people who want this, with closed source software the learning stops at some point, you can't learn everything about your Windows-Pi even though it was create…

> Can there really be people that are willing and able to build their own IOT but do not want to learn about Linux? Absolutely, and especially in corporate environments. I'm not saying Windows 10 IoT is any better (I think it's very unlikely to be, but I also haven't evaluated it), but I can say for certain that I wish I had a single, identical python library for any IoT platform that handled interfaces as simply as:…

Like this?

  from time import sleep
  import RPi.GPIO as GPIO
  GPIO.setmode(GPIO.BCM)
  GPIO.setup(2, GPIO.OUT)
  while 1:
       GPIO.output(2, False)
       sleep(2)
       GPIO.output(2, True)
Perhaps I'm not understanding what you want exactly, you seem to know what you're doing.
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