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Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

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Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#31

Post by nickodell »

Amorymeltzer wrote: post #21
zachrose wrote: post #18

I have an NPM package named "barrel"[0], which apparently is also a trademark for some kind of sunglasses company. I would expect there to be some kind of fair-use-like rule for common nouns that are used in different industries or domains? [0] https://www.npmjs.com/package/barrel

At least in the US, the rule is essentially confusion: is a consumer likely to be confused? In both cases (yours and kik) the likelihood of real confusion is unlikely, although admittedly sunglasses are a couple steps more removed than a messaging app. Good reading is the Apple V Apple series of court cases: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Corps_v_Apple_Computer

True, but the brouhaha over kik was over npm's module name dispute policy.

So, it seems like the operative questions are 1) How likely is X to create an npm package? and 2) If a node.js developer types `npm install X`, are they more likely to expect X's package, or my package?

For the parent commenter, 1 is a definite no, and 2 is kinda wishy-washy.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#33

Post by Tehnix »

jessaustin wrote: post #17
thinkpad20 wrote: post #3

Am I parsing it incorrectly in my head, or does this project have a blatantly antisemitic name?

You are reading correctly. The project name doesn't follow English inflection rules. Just as e.g. "tap" becomes "tapped", "kik" should become "kikked". "Kiked" is an inflection of "kike", just as "liked" is an inflection of "like" and "taped" is an inflection of "tape". This mistake is easy to make, since there aren't any English verbs spelled ending "ik"; words with this sound are instead spelled ending "ick".

The "Kiked" should probably be read as "Kik'ed" and in any regards, "Kikked" would be wrong. Kik is an entity and not a word in itself here. Try replacing it with "IBM'ed", "Microsoft'ed", "Facebook'ed" etc. The last one is the closest one, you wouldn't be saying "Facebookked".

As a side-note, I in no way think the author made any association with the word kike. Even though I know the word, I didn't jump to that conclusion at least, especially given the context.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#34

Post by SilasX »

jessaustin wrote: post #17
thinkpad20 wrote: post #3

Am I parsing it incorrectly in my head, or does this project have a blatantly antisemitic name?

You are reading correctly. The project name doesn't follow English inflection rules. Just as e.g. "tap" becomes "tapped", "kik" should become "kikked". "Kiked" is an inflection of "kike", just as "liked" is an inflection of "like" and "taped" is an inflection of "tape". This mistake is easy to make, since there aren't any English verbs spelled ending "ik"; words with this sound are instead spelled ending "ick".

Well said (ditto for Tehnix). It would have also worked to name the site `canibekik-ed`.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#35

Post by phamilton »

atom_enger wrote: post #11
dindresto wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry if it is rather obvious, but I cannot see it. Would you care to elaborate? (no native English speaker here)

It's the last five letters without the d. It's an ethnic slur for a Jewish person. Here you go if you're interested in the history or etymology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kike

The Etymology is fascinating:

> The word kike was born on Ellis Island when there were Jewish migrants who were also illiterate (or could not use Latin alphabet letters). When asked to sign the entry-forms with the customary "X," the Jewish immigrants would refuse, because they associated an X with the cross of Christianity. Instead, they drew a circle as the signature on the entry-forms. The Yiddish word for "circle" is kikel (pronounced ky-kul), and for "little circle," kikeleh (pronounced ky-kul-uh). Before long the immigration inspectors were calling anyone who signed with an "O" in place of an "X" a kikel or kikeleh or kikee or, finally and succinctly, kike.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#36

Post by earlyresort »

josh2600 wrote: post #7
thinkpad20 wrote: post #3

Am I parsing it incorrectly in my head, or does this project have a blatantly antisemitic name?

You are parsing it incorrectly. Can I be 'kik'-ed. Kik being the operative word here not the slur to which you refer.

Perhaps my background makes me a little more attuned to this particular word, but 'kike' practically leapt off the page to me.

In English, words ending in a single short vowel followed by a single consonant double the consonant before adding '-ed' to form the past tense. That's the grammatical rule.

I still can't tell if this project is by someone with bad grammar or some 4chan-bred bigot trying to make a double entendre, but either way, it's fucking obnoxious to see it on the front page of Hacker News.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#37

Post by phamilton »

partisan wrote: post #22
coreyp_1 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird. I'm from Texas, in my 30's, and have never heard the word before. Then again, growing up I never heard anyone talking bad about Jews either.

I think you would have to wallowing deep in anti-semitism to use a word like that so it is a good thing you aren't surrounded by people like that.

Or live in a predominant Jewish community and hear kids on the playground using it as a joke because both parties were Jewish.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#38

Post by gyardley »

Tehnix wrote: post #33
jessaustin wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are reading correctly. The project name doesn't follow English inflection rules. Just as e.g. "tap" becomes "tapped", "kik" should become "kikked". "Kiked" is an inflection of "kike", just as "liked" is an inflection of "like" and "taped" is an inflection of "tape". This mistake is easy to make, since there aren't any English verbs spelled ending "ik"; words with this sound are instead spelled ending "ick".

The "Kiked" should probably be read as "Kik'ed" and in any regards, "Kikked" would be wrong. Kik is an entity and not a word in itself here. Try replacing it with "IBM'ed", "Microsoft'ed", "Facebook'ed" etc. The last one is the closest one, you wouldn't be saying "Facebookked". As a side-note, I in no way think the author made any association with the word kike. Even though I know the word, I didn't jump to that conc…

The entity has nothing to do with it. Back when I worked for the comparison shopping NexTag, for example, people would certainly joke about being 'nextagged', not 'nextaged', which would've been read as something completely different.

None of IBM, Microsoft, or Facebook end in exactly one 'short' vowel plus one consonant, which is the rule, in English, that determines when the final consonant is doubled. That's why your examples don't work.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#39

Post by pavel_lishin »

Kristine1975 wrote: post #27
StavrosK wrote: post #26

20 comments about the name here and none of you bothered to open an issue. For shame!

Someone just did: https://github.com/parro-it/canibekiked/issues/2 :-)

And like an idiot, I waded in.

Re: Show HN: Kikked – check if any of your NPM repos is trademarked

#40

Post by pavel_lishin »

coreyp_1 wrote: post #15
themgt wrote: post #13

"Canibekik'd" please

It's funny, but this is, in a way, a parallel of what happened to the original "kik" project, in that there is a suggestion of name change because of the perception of some people.

Was the same argument made for kik, or was there a different name originally?
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