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Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

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Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#31

Post by booksnarf »

amichail wrote: post #22
yan wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The above post. I used to think that Dawkins & co's books were just preaching to the choir. Yeah, I found them fun to read and nod along, but I didn't believe they'd change anyone's mind. I assume that this isn't an issue of logic, and when you're not dealing with logic for the most part, no logical argument would be sufficient. Reading posts like these do make me believe that it's possible to change minds, if people…

Do you think that being a good atheist requires a certain level of intelligence that many people don't have? In particular, the extent to which a person can predict the consequences of his/her actions is probably highly dependent on intelligence. Religion can be viewed as taking some of this unfairness away.

Well, religion and intelligence have been shown to be inversely correlated. Perhaps 'intelligence' is the wrong word; educational level might be better.

For example, only 7 percent of the members in the U.S. National Academy of Sciences believe in a personal god [1]. I forget the numbers for the general public of the US (I don't have the book with me), but it was the vast majority who believed in a personal god.

Of course: grains of salt, correlation vs. causation, etc.

I don't think being an atheist requires a certain level of intelligence, but I do think that people of a certain level of education have been taught to think critically about everything they read/learn/work with, which probably bleeds over into their personal life.

[1] Victor J. Stenger. Has Science Found God? p.78

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#32

Post by JangoSteve »

phugoid wrote: post #14

Something I read in Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell shocked me into reconsidering my role as a father. I'm not a big fan of that book in general, but I found a pearl in there. I used to think that I needed to set and enforce hard rules, as if this will teach my kids order. I don't want them to take the easy way out or try to negotiate everything. I thought my approach was a good balance to my wife's, as she doesn't asse…

Outliers has also recently made me think more seriously about the role of luck in an individual's overall success. It is amazing the role it plays. In fact, I'm really suprised that the book didn't mention Lord Timothy Dexter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Dexter), who is the epitome of success by luck.

However, it hasn't changed my overall viewpoint that it is largely up to the person to continually position themselves such that they are receptive to luck. Another way to look at it is by stating the corollary... that the only certain path to failure is to not try.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#33

Post by pasbesoin »

Gun control in the U.S.. I used to be more in favor, with the goal of a safer society as well as one less inclined to the isolation of sub-populations.

Now, I'm considering widespread ownership more in terms of a last bulwark against one or another form of totalitarian rule. Perhaps it is a limiting factor against pushing the population too far. You might call this a knee-jerk reaction; nonetheless, it's on my mind.

I still consider most unfortunate the additional, lethal violence that the ready availability of firearms (legal and illegal) seems to cause. The question for me is, is it a -- I hate to use this term -- necessary cost.

I feel a little uncomfortable writing about this, nor do I claim to be especially informed on the topic, but since you asked.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#34

Post by btilly »

amichail wrote: post #22
yan wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The above post. I used to think that Dawkins & co's books were just preaching to the choir. Yeah, I found them fun to read and nod along, but I didn't believe they'd change anyone's mind. I assume that this isn't an issue of logic, and when you're not dealing with logic for the most part, no logical argument would be sufficient. Reading posts like these do make me believe that it's possible to change minds, if people…

Do you think that being a good atheist requires a certain level of intelligence that many people don't have? In particular, the extent to which a person can predict the consequences of his/her actions is probably highly dependent on intelligence. Religion can be viewed as taking some of this unfairness away.

In my experience and from statistics I have seen there is little correlation between intelligence and religious inclination. For example Donald Knuth is strongly religious. (Evidence: http://www-cs-faculty.stanford.edu/~knuth/things.html. ) But can anyone honestly deny his intelligence?

That is not to say that there is no correlation. In general educated people are more likely to be exposed to thoughtful commentary on atheism, and are therefore more likely to consider the idea. But the correlation seems to be with exposure, and not propensity to be convinced by it.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#35

Post by araneae »

Alex3917 wrote: post #21
booksnarf wrote: post #17

Religion. I was born & raised a devout Baptist Christian (and creationist). But in the past 5 months, I've read about 50 books and hundreds of web pages and decided that agnostic atheism [1] and evolution make more sense. Hopefully I didn't just devolve this into a religion argument... [1] "Agnostic atheist" == I can't say for certain but I think God is very improbable, and I will live my life on the assumption he is…

Same here, only the other way. After being an atheist my entire life, I got more interested in religion over the past few months. After listening to dozens of hours worth of podcasts, and reading a few books and academic journal articles, I've decided that there is such a thing as a "primary religious experience." Furthermore, it's pretty clear that while academia can verify that this experience exists, science can't…

The feeling of "spirituality" is certainly universal; after all, so many people have it that it would be absurd to call it purely a cultural construct. However, as far as we can tell, the generation of these feelings is not associated with any external sensor, the way that the experience of seeing is connected with your eyeballs. In all probability, the feeling of religiosity is mind-bound phenomena, much like love and awe, and are not capable of detecting any real external phenomena.

On another note...

I'm an atheist, but I wasn't religiously abused as a kid. I just am interested in science. The fantasies of others is considerably less entertaining than understanding the nature of the universe.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#37

Post by icey »

crystalis wrote: post #36

I recently changed my mind about the quality of the producers and consumers on HN.

Can you clarify? You haven't been registered here for long, so I'm curious as to what sort of trends you've noticed that have caused you to change your mind.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#38

Post by protomyth »

pasbesoin wrote: post #33

Gun control in the U.S.. I used to be more in favor, with the goal of a safer society as well as one less inclined to the isolation of sub-populations. Now, I'm considering widespread ownership more in terms of a last bulwark against one or another form of totalitarian rule. Perhaps it is a limiting factor against pushing the population too far. You might call this a knee-jerk reaction; nonetheless, it's on my mind.…

About 15 years ago, I was at a state sponsored meeting in Minot ND. A group the state hired was there telling us about risk factors in the community. The group hired was from the west coast and all the research they cited was studies done in low income urban areas. They pointed out guns were a big risk factor. The head of one of the local social service programs took exception to this. He asked how many people in the room owned a gun. With the exception of myself, everyone raised their hands (my parents owned firearms and I never bought one myself). He then started counting upwards and more then half owned over 3 firearms. He felt the study had no relevance to the area. Examine Switzerland for another example of prevalent firearms.

People inclined to do violence to others will do so regardless of the weapons available. Swimming pools are more dangerous to children than firearms in the house. My take has always been that the weakening of one amendment will allow avenues of attack on the others.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#39

Post by tel »

My desire to become a doctor. As a college undergraduate in a biomedical engineering major there's a lot of contact and allure toward that field, but after extensive shadowing experience in the ER I realized that while I undeniably admire those who can become doctors, there is absolutely something missing, for me, in that profession:

The ability to innovate, build, create, explore. An MD's life is more oriented toward dispensing the benefits of knowledge than actively seeking, crafting more.

Re: Ask HN: What have you changed your mind about recently?

#40

Post by DanielBMarkham »

RiderOfGiraffes wrote: post #30

Whether I really belong here. I used to think it was a given, now I'm really not sure. So much stuff I'm interested in gets completely ignored, and I'm pretty sure it's been seen. There's the occasional zinger, but I no longer think I'm a good match for this community.

That's an interesting frame to the question -- whether you are a good match for the community.

Wouldn't the question work better the other way around -- Whether the community was a good match for you or not?

You would judge the answer based on how much the community helped you reach your goals. Whereas with the other question you're always looking outward for somebody else to validate you (which seems prone to getting bad feedback!)

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