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Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

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31–38 of 38 posts

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#31

I don't know about ethics, as such, but you, as a consumer, can make decisions that are better than others. For example: it's better for your health to eat pasture-raised, free-range animals (and stay well away from feedlot raised). The nutrition profile of the meat is much better. Try buying from a butcher instead of a supermarket, and you'll be supporting a small business and probably get better product. Buy good q…

I'm not really a fan of compensary activities, because the guilt is often a more effective control. I've seen people do weird things like donate away 100% of the bribes they take. It gets rid of the guilt, but not the impact.

I'd say just keep your meat consumption low and also donate $100 to tree planting every now and then.

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you slaughter humans? They have more value to society than meat, such as in economic output. Non-human animals have no such utility, that's why they're used for meat. (Well, I guess draft animals have been used in farming, so that's extra utility they have, but we have industrialization for that now.)

I feel like I just stumbled into an Amazon executive team meeting.

That’s how a large part of the world thinks though.

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#34

You are starting from an assumption it is unethical barring some exceptions. That is false.

> That is false. I and many other people believe it's true, with quite a lot of reason and evidence of all kinds, not just "This is what's always been done." Your just saying "That is false" seems merely a less polite version of "I don't agree", i.e. "You are wrong." Hopefully exchanges on HN can do better than that.

What's to disagree. It is indeed an opinion. That you seem to think yours is beyond question is telling.

Practically all humans on earth agree with me and have done for several hundred thousand years.

Your argument stems from a constructed stance of moral purity; akin to religious pleas to embrace poverty and self flagellation.

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#35
There is also evidence to suggest that diets with lots of vegetables are good for auto-immune disease by lowering inflammation.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/healthy-weight/...

Have you tried the Mediterranean diet?

The most ethical diet that includes meat, in my opinion, is eating mostly plants and then hunting your own meat. Most people also don’t need nearly as much meat as they think they do. 1-2 servings per week could be sufficient - which could be easily covered by fishing or hunting a few times per year and then freezing.

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#36

I did this for a month and it was great as far as feeling better. I’m someone who’s had annoying, uncomfortable psoriasis and to be honest it was already going away for about 1.5 months prior to starting carnivore. This was the only diet that I was able to stick to after 5 days of an adjustment period. Bulletproof coffee, athletic greens, vitamin d and turmeric supplements along with the meat meals usually cooked wit…

What sort of meat meals did you cook?

bacon & eggs, ground beef, steaks, burger patties, ribs, pork rind chips, wendys double-baconator (no buns or fries), fish, salmon, kippers, and bbq meats.

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#37
post #21

Who cares about emissions, seriously? Imagine millions of humans were being slaughtered instead of animals. I'm glad you're thinking about this, but the big problem with eating meat is not emissions, it's the suffering of millions of sentient beings. For all others: Please go ahead and downvote this comment. You're not a lion hunting prey for food. You're just a guy buying a dead animal at a store. As for your origin…

I see your view and raise the complexity: one problem is the suffering, another is the emissions. There are a lot of humans on this planet, and our demand for meat is huge, leading to significant emissions from the animals all the way down the chain to our stomachs. If we all ate meat in the proportion chimpanzees do (about 3% of their diet), we'd have less impact (emissions, biodiversity, land use) and no one would need to forego meat entirely.

My personal choices are a drop in the ocean compared to what collective action can do. Convincing voters and elected officials to enact strict and equitable legislation feels like the most impactful thing we can do. (In addition to lobbying, I also like to read and comment on HN)

Re: Ask HN: Ethics of a carnivore diet?

#38
In reading through the 34 comments I don't see any mention of going longer without food (fasting) to address autoimmune and inflammation issues.[0]

Ethics: the best I can say is "that's cultural", and often personal. We're all doing whatever we want, and sometimes our values align enough to get along for a long time. I ate a lot of meat for about a year (or so; I didn't keep a log) and then stopped for a couple reasons, including environmental impact. I grew up on a farm, I've butchered animals and eaten them, I've hunted, and I see every living creature as an individual person worthy of respect. And still I kill them. If we were more honest about this when we go to war I think we'd be better off, rather than all the othering and dehumanizing that is so effective.[1]

My internet-stranger advice would be to practice going without food for longer and longer (it took me about two months to go past the ~48 hours when autophagy starts; I paced myself so I could keep an even keel at work (parenting/homemaking)), and then break your fast with an amazing meal, starting with foods high in fiber (something about how the food progresses through the intestines, and absorbing nutrients, and not spiking insulin), and including whatever you want (I only want high-quality, healthy food for these meals, maybe ending with more carbohydrates at the end). Meat seems like a reasonable inclusion if eating fewer meals. Fasting and feasting is different than calorie restriction; the former I find empowering and self-respecting, the latter I found torturous.

In any case, I hope you figure it out, and good luck!

References: [0] Life in the Fasting Lane, by Jason Fung, Eve Mayer, and Megan Ramos

[1] On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society, by Dave Grossman

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