291–300 of 593 posts
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those countries like Germany, Austria, etc?
Let's add Norway and probably Sweden as well to that list.
Making employers responsible for severance pay is a way of aligning costs with information asymmetry, and also trying to make employers at least a little sensitive to the impact their whims can have on real people's lives.
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It doesn't matter, the difference is not enough, and the developer in SF is still much better off.
The developer in SF might be financially better off, but the developer in Berlin is better off in general.
I’ve been checking layoffs.fyi every day and it is incredibly bleak
This is looking 2001-dot-com-crash bad, but much, much faster. It's worth remembering there are plenty of companies not laying people off, and "normal" will return eventually. That said, I was watching The Big Short yesterday, and a line that I had noted before haunted me even more: "For every 1% unemployment goes up [in the USA], 40,000 people die". Stay safe, stay positive.
No severance?! I, as an expat, am absolutely grateful and have changed my tune on the “European welfare state” trope to “this just makes sense”. I got let go from a Berlin based fintech and got 3 months pay plus a small severance. They did this likely because funding fell apart during the pandemic but it could have also been to cull people that they didn’t need but they did do right by us.
Surprisingly, severance is also mandatory in Argentina and many other "under development" countries. I'm absolutely amazed at how people in the US are so against severance being mandatory.
1 - If you make it too hard to let people go, companies will be less willing to hire. (You’ve added a cost to the employee)
2 - If you make the cost of severance too high, it will kill companies that might otherwise have a chance to squeak through.
There are plenty of good arguments on the other side (companies offloading social costs to the govt, etc) but these two are consistent with economic theory on labor supply and demand.
Can someone please change the title of this - just as with other similar posts - to use "laid-off" instead of "fired"? Regardless of how loose some may be with language, there's a clear distinction between these terms. For example, my home state's Employment Security Department: https://esd.wa.gov/unemployment/laid-off-or-fired Given that there are non-US readers here, maybe there's another pair of phrases that Hacke…
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Why would it be? Europe is getting hit a lot harder and its economy is quickly collapsing. European banks were also weaker and less stress resistant than their US's counterparts so their ability to lend isn't a strong. Same thing for the EU corporations themselves, who are usually more in debt and have less access to non-bank financing (ie public bonds markets). So I'd be really surprised if we saw more lay offs in t…
One reason that it's could be less bad is due to government measures - e.g. in the Netherlands, employers can apply for the government to pay 90% of your salary for a while while they pay the other 10%, so that they can keep employing you until (hopefully) after things start up again. No idea how that compares to other companies, but if it differs, that's one possible explanation for different results.
https://www.thestreet.com/personal-finance/cares-act-paychec...
No severance?! I, as an expat, am absolutely grateful and have changed my tune on the “European welfare state” trope to “this just makes sense”. I got let go from a Berlin based fintech and got 3 months pay plus a small severance. They did this likely because funding fell apart during the pandemic but it could have also been to cull people that they didn’t need but they did do right by us.
> No severance?! I agree that no severance sucks. Although keep in mind that in theory, higher salaries should equal hire savings. The average developer in SF makes more than the average developer in Berlin (how much more... maybe 2X)? If you could make 100% more & forego a severance package, would you? It's not a real world choice, I'm just trying to offer context that one way to look at higher salaries is that you…
In France if you earn 50k/month, your boss actually pays you ~100k. 50k is going in your pocket, and the other 50k goes to a centralized fund which pays for healthcare, pensions, and unemployment compensations ; things you would have paid for yourself otherwise.
People in France complains a LOT about those 50k that are "lost" but in fact there are "forced savings", or "indirect salary", what they don't realize is that not having a centralized compulsory saving system end would up costing them so, so much more.
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Why would it be? Europe is getting hit a lot harder and its economy is quickly collapsing. European banks were also weaker and less stress resistant than their US's counterparts so their ability to lend isn't a strong. Same thing for the EU corporations themselves, who are usually more in debt and have less access to non-bank financing (ie public bonds markets). So I'd be really surprised if we saw more lay offs in t…
One reason that it's could be less bad is due to government measures - e.g. in the Netherlands, employers can apply for the government to pay 90% of your salary for a while while they pay the other 10%, so that they can keep employing you until (hopefully) after things start up again. No idea how that compares to other companies, but if it differs, that's one possible explanation for different results.
https://www.uschamber.com/series/above-the-fold/how-access-s...
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Hurting the company is the point of this kind of protests, but you shouldn't do it alone with your company credentials for sure. Some employers may want to fire the people who organize the protests, but in France the employees representatives are more protected than others and you can't fire them easily. It has pros and cons.
How protected is this kind of direct action? If it's ok to disrupt the company's services is it also ok to disclose or destroy customer data? Where does the law draw the line? I've heard about workers in France literally kidnapping and stripping the clothes from their bosses and it being tolerated. I think that kind of thing is never tolerable under any civil circumstance. If a co-worker tried to kidnap me I'd see th…
Well the persons responsibles for stripping the Air France HR guy got 3 to 4 months jail sentences, so I don't know if I would call that "tolerated".
At the same time, in the US there's litterally an idiom for starting to kill your coworkers if I'm correct : "going postal".
So, overall, I prefer the most violent thing to happen at work to be shirt stripping.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
One reason that it's could be less bad is due to government measures - e.g. in the Netherlands, employers can apply for the government to pay 90% of your salary for a while while they pay the other 10%, so that they can keep employing you until (hopefully) after things start up again. No idea how that compares to other companies, but if it differs, that's one possible explanation for different results.
Only 90%? In the US, the CARES Act is paying 250% of payroll costs! https://www.thestreet.com/personal-finance/cares-act-paychec...
That said, my overall point was that different measures can lead to different results - not that specific measures were different.