Ask HN: How Do You Read? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#171

Post by dredmorbius » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:17 AM UTC

Baeocystin wrote: post #129

guidoism wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The opposite. Non-fiction books should be read in multiple passes, like a video encoder. - First pass: Understand the structure, important words (from index), some interesting passages. - Second pass: Read it all the way through, don't worry if you don't understand stuff - Third pass: Look up stuff that you didn't understand from the previous pass and read it again in order to understand them. - Four pass: Read it co…

I would go so far as to say all books should be read in an iterative manner, fiction or not. Good stories will reveal previously-missed tidbits again & again as you explore the deeper structure of the work.

Deep reading should be saved for books worth the effort.

There's far more written than you'll ever be able to read. The cost of discovery is a large impediment to that.

Skimming / scanning (contents, index, bibliography, intro/conclusion chapters) is part of the informational assessment. If the book holds up to that, keep digging into it. If not, set it down, and feel no guilt.

I'm reading a lot of material, though I'm not satisfied with my methods or progress. I've found Adler's book highly useful. The principle problem is that my interests have both breadth and depth sufficient that the volume of relevant material is enormous, and quality assessment is complicated. I'm doing the best I can.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#172

Post by sarcasmOrTears » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:20 AM UTC

When I want to understand something I don't read a book, I read multiple books about a topic. I did this and got quite informed about many useless topics (energy industry, austrian economics, history of science). Instead if I jump topics from one book to the next, I lose basically everything. Also if you re-read books after some time, you get new insights.

As for programming (probably for anything you treat as a profession), I've noticed that you cannot beat practice, but if the topic is new to you, it's better to read the whole book first. It's much faster because you see what to expect and don't waste time when you practice on stuff that is easy and not as powerful as something else. Also you don't waste comfiguring tools only to discover that the tech doesn't really interest you anyway.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#173

Post by nyolfen » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:21 AM UTC

disabled wrote: post #160

This is slightly off topic but some people may find this setup interesting. I have a print-related disability, so I use screen readers to speak printed material to me. I actually prefer synthesized speech over human narrated audio. The screen readers I use: * Voice Dream Reader (available on iOS and Android, but it is much better on iOS) * Kurzweil 3000 (available on Windows and MacOS), plus Kurzweil3000.com (on any…

i like the idea of voice dream reader in theory, but in practice i find the voice synth kind of poor and difficult to listen to. i should probably just subscribe to audible but the reason i wanted it was for audio of pirated ebooks.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#174

Post by dominotw » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:21 AM UTC

8ytecoder wrote: post #48

guidoism wrote: post #16

Great question! In my fourth decade of life I’m finally figuring out the optimal way to do this myself. I’ve forgotten so so many books over the years that I supposedly read. Read How to Read a Book: The Classic Guide to Intelligent Reading by Mortimer Adler. ( https://www.amazon.com/How-Read-Book-Classic-Intelligent/dp/... ) I’ve given this book to a bunch of people on my teams as it also helps with communicating id…

One of the reasons I love the kindle. I highlight my favourite quotes and phrases regularly and then after I finish the book I summarise it into an essay. For instructional books I make a bullet point list of key learnings.

This is primarily how i built my english vocabulary. Seeing words in context and connection makes them stick better.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#175

Post by dredmorbius » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:24 AM UTC

ch3ckmat3 wrote: post #155

When I read a book, in the middle of a paragraph, I start getting new ideas related to the topic, and my mind shifts focus to the news ideas, while my eyes keep tracing the text on the book, and obviously I'm not "reading" now, I'm just wandering in my thoughts. And when I realize that I have drifted from the book, I just go back to the text from which my mind drifted. Some times this happens a lot, and I take so muc…

It depends on the work, writing, my state of mind, etc.

As I learn more about a topic, bad writing gets easier to read (there's little in it), good writing gets harder (it keeps jogging other associations or revealing new sources). I have to actively assimilate that information. Increasingly, I track down interesting references as I'm reading, if possible.

I can read an easy novel (two of the most recent: The Martian and The Circle) in a few hours. It may take me months or years to work fully through a meaty book, though a week or so is possible if I'm focused. (I rarely am.)

This incidentally makes working with library loans almost impossible -- I don't have as much time with the material, and my reading style is quite active, marking up, starring, or making marginal notes. That's fine for my own copies of works, it's exceedingly disrepectful for shared texts.

(Though I still have fond memories reading through a uni library copy of a Jane Jacobs book in which an earlier reader had penciled "God bless you, Jane" to a particular passage. I agreed with the sentiment.)

For focusing: sometimes I just tell myself to focus on the material at hand, take quick notes if necessary (index cards), and plough through. When that gets too hard -- after an hour or two usually -- I figure it's time to stop and switch to something else.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#176

Post by Baeocystin » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:41 AM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #171

Baeocystin wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would go so far as to say all books should be read in an iterative manner, fiction or not. Good stories will reveal previously-missed tidbits again & again as you explore the deeper structure of the work.

Deep reading should be saved for books worth the effort. There's far more written than you'll ever be able to read. The cost of discovery is a large impediment to that. Skimming / scanning (contents, index, bibliography, intro/conclusion chapters) is part of the informational assessment. If the book holds up to that, keep digging into it. If not, set it down, and feel no guilt. I'm reading a lot of material, though I…

I should clarify- I fully agree with your assessment. Sturgeon's law holds true with books as much as anything, and there is plenty that can be tossed aside after only a cursory glance.

My point was aimed along the lines that if a book is worth reading once, you will benefit from rereading it at a future date.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#177

Post by dominotw » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:41 AM UTC

disabled wrote: post #166

mattlondon wrote: post #49

Interesting... Lots of people seem to read a lot of books - I get lots of recommendations from people at work and stuff. People talk about reading a book a week or whatever. I've never enjoyed reading books - right from childhood up to now. I try to avoid it. I have gifts from birthdays and christmases from years ago where the book sits entirely unread on the shelf for a year or two until I give it away once the guil…

Reading more than 3-4 paragraphs in more than one stretch is usually too hard for me. When I was a kid (plus in university), I just thought I was lazy (also I did not think my eyes had a problem, either). Anyways, I have to get my eyes checked out every year because I have type 1 diabetes, and my print-related disability was missed by ophthalmologists, year after year, until I was diagnosed with a medical problem tha…

i feel like something weird is going on with my eyes. After staring at a screen for an hour i have hard time focusing them and feels like thye are being pulll out of the eye sockets. Its really hard to describe but not sure what to do about it or how to even describe it.

I would like to not use any screens for a couple of month and see if that fixes it but I am unable to make room for that kind of a program.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#178

Post by dredmorbius » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:42 AM UTC

I largely read nonfiction, largely to gain an understanding of questions or problems or methods. I'll read fiction for pleasure occasionally, and certainly have in the past. That's almost always far easier.

I read actively, and am a fan of Mortimer Adler's How to Read a Book, mentioned by others. The methods it describes are much as I'd developed on my own, though I've picked up a few pointers.

I consider books resources to aid in an inquiry. I've an idea of the questions I'm interested in, and exploring the development, presentation, and explorations of those questions guides what I read.

My "to read" pile is ... unmanageable. I've collected thousands of books and articles, which I consider not an obligation to read, but a pre-vetted resource to dig into in more depth. Bibliographies, footnotes, annotations, and references within works are very useful at turning up other works. Generally, my highest priority is on foundational works within a field, or revolutionary works which either break new ground or synthesize existing ideas into a new whole. As I've studied, I've found myself generally less interested in the most recent material -- it's often far less substantive than earlier works, much rehashes older concepts (with or without credit or reference), though sometimes in the context of some contemporary crisis or issue. (Much of HN's submissions and discussion fall into this class.)

Cultivating my own discipline to work through material I've alreday surfaced is difficult, though I've at least skimmed through a reasonably large share. Tools for organising and managing a large personal research library are sadly lacking, and progress toward realising the dream outlined by Vannevar Bush in his Memex, or Ted Nelson's Project Xanadu, has been sadly disappointing.

I'm actively looking for tips at improving my tools and methods. Reducing the reading pile being a principle objective.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#179

Post by philwelch » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:44 AM UTC

klingonopera wrote: post #149

inflatableDodo wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have in my hand a 1942 edition of the 'Seven Pillars of Wisdom' by T.E. Lawrence that I am currently half way through. Can you suggest which credible data source on the internet is going to compete with Lawrence's first hand account of events?

An approved and verified word-by-word upload of it, preferably on some public institution's servers. Judging by the amount of downvotes I've received, people are clearly not making the distinction between content and format, which I regress, was the point I was attempting to make.

That’s just an ebook, though.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#180

Post by Rapzid » Sun, Sep 01, 2019, 3:44 AM UTC

stingraycharles wrote: post #9

I feel like I’m an outlier here on HN, but I read very slowly. My mind constantly switches back and forth between other stuff, and frequently have to repeat (sections of) a page just because I wasn’t paying enough attention. Needless to say, I don’t read a lot. Once in a while I find a book that interests me, and usually it takes me around a week or two to complete (when reading around 30 - 60 minutes a day).

I read much slower than I know I can, and slower than other people I know. Typically if I'm not just searching for information I'm thinking deeply about what I'm reading, and in the case of novels I'm enjoying it as an experience like watching a movie or traveling. Or, I'm re-reading pages because my mind wandered :)

That said I know I can speed read and retain information even if I'm rather rusty for things outside of information lookup/skimming. But I find if I speed read and can recall information about it that doesn't mean I've developed any insights or enjoyed what I read as an experience.