Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#1

Post by latraveler » Fri, Mar 29, 2013, 5:19 AM UTC

I'm thinking about mashing up (old term I know) two services but I ran into a roadblock when I came across Yelp's ToS. The lawyers drew this thing up so tight I can't figure out any legitimate use of their API and have come across seemingly conflicting clauses. Take a look, its good for a laugh http://www.yelp.com/developers/getting_started/api_terms.

My question is, what have your experiences been with approaching companies about their API terms? Is there a good way to approach it? Obviously my biggest fear is spending the time to develop the service only to have them shut it done.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#2

Post by pm24601 » Fri, Mar 29, 2013, 7:27 AM UTC

I "love" clause 6D:

"You agree that you will not, and will not assist or enable others to: use the API on behalf of any third party;"

So in other words, no one can use the API except to get Yelp information about themselves.

What a fucking joke.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#3

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Mar 29, 2013, 10:28 AM UTC

pm24601 wrote: post #2

I "love" clause 6D: "You agree that you will not, and will not assist or enable others to: use the API on behalf of any third party;" So in other words, no one can use the API except to get Yelp information about themselves. What a fucking joke.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#4

Post by jfoster » Fri, Mar 29, 2013, 10:52 AM UTC

Sometimes the terms might be more restrictive than is actually enforced. Doesn't really help with your fear, but if you avoid undermining them in every way you can, it's probably less likely that they'll try to cut you off. Having a backup plan (Google Local API?) probably isn't a bad idea, though.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#5

Post by ig1 » Fri, Mar 29, 2013, 12:36 PM UTC

Use APIs in ways that add value to the provider (i.e. you're paying them or adding value for their users). If it's in their interest to keep you alive then then they're most likely to keep the API going.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#6

Post by dtsingletary » Sat, Mar 30, 2013, 2:26 AM UTC

pm24601 wrote: post #2

I "love" clause 6D: "You agree that you will not, and will not assist or enable others to: use the API on behalf of any third party;" So in other words, no one can use the API except to get Yelp information about themselves. What a fucking joke.

The spirit of that is most likely: "You won't resell or grant your access to the API to other people, or allow someone else to to resell or grant access to the API."

Not generally the content you're getting from the API (although you wouldn't be selling or providing that to others, either, you'd be creating some derivative of it).

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#7

Post by dtsingletary » Sat, Mar 30, 2013, 2:27 AM UTC

Contacting them is your best option. Find some one to talk to, explain what you'd like to do, and how the terms restrict you, and see if you can't find a way to have an exception, clarification, or some other way around it.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#8

Post by pm24601 » Sat, Mar 30, 2013, 5:12 PM UTC

dtsingletary wrote: post #6

pm24601 wrote: post #2

I "love" clause 6D: "You agree that you will not, and will not assist or enable others to: use the API on behalf of any third party;" So in other words, no one can use the API except to get Yelp information about themselves. What a fucking joke.

The spirit of that is most likely: "You won't resell or grant your access to the API to other people, or allow someone else to to resell or grant access to the API." Not generally the content you're getting from the API (although you wouldn't be selling or providing that to others, either, you'd be creating some derivative of it).

Well that may be YOUR spirit but for YELP'S spirit I have to rely on the language in the TOS.

I say this as a developer building a product in which yelp's reviews are directly useful.

Re: Ask HN: What to do with ultra tight API terms?

#9

Post by dtsingletary » Sat, Mar 30, 2013, 6:29 PM UTC

pm24601 wrote: post #8

dtsingletary wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spirit of that is most likely: "You won't resell or grant your access to the API to other people, or allow someone else to to resell or grant access to the API." Not generally the content you're getting from the API (although you wouldn't be selling or providing that to others, either, you'd be creating some derivative of it).

Well that may be YOUR spirit but for YELP'S spirit I have to rely on the language in the TOS. I say this as a developer building a product in which yelp's reviews are directly useful.

Which is why it behooves you to contact them and get clarification, exception, etc. The same rules don't apply to everyone equally if you can make the right case. Simply displaying their content is not likely to get a pass, but having a way to brand it well and drive new content creation often will.