NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
1–10 of 23 posts
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#2Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#3Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
Cab drivers will pass it on to passengers as part of the fare, and those passengers probably tend to be wealthier. Those who can't afford cabs, and many who can, will be more likely to take public transit (which is the point).
If it actually makes more money for better public transit I would consider it a success. And whether or not that happens, it'll reduce traffic in Manhattan which I think most people would also agree is welcome.
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#4Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
> every single cab driver […] will have to deal with this
>riders in taxis will pay a 75-cent fee
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#5Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
It is regressive in the sense that car owners will now need to take public transportation. Said public transportation also gets more funding. This is perfect for a city with 5 min subways from NJ to Manhattan. More people should be taking this.
I would argue that this is the perfect kind of tax - if the city already has a robust public transportation system.
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#6Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
Cab drivers will pass it on to passengers as part of the fare, and those passengers probably tend to be wealthier. Those who can't afford cabs, and many who can, will be more likely to take public transit (which is the point). If it actually makes more money for better public transit I would consider it a success. And whether or not that happens, it'll reduce traffic in Manhattan which I think most people would also…
You think the money collected will fix one pothole in NY, one MTA track, one subway signal? You think traffic signals will be replaced? Or street marks will be repainted? The money collected will be spent on more bureaucracy.
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#7Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
It may end up easing traffic for billionaires :).
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#8An important piece of context, which might not be immediately apparent from this discussion, is that a vast majority of people in and around New York City dislike and distrust the MTA (NYC's public transit organization) to an extreme extent[3][4]. People widely view the MTA as ineffective and its spending as suspect. The MTA has more than doubled fares in recent years[1][2], yet has nothing to show for it.
So, when a policy proposal seeks to send more money to the MTA, people will naturally be skeptical. If all the money so far hasn't made a difference, and NYC public transit is still on a bad trajectory, how can, and indeed why should, we trust giving the MTA even more money yet again?
In particular, (from the article) the MTA claims that the money will fund the 2nd Avenue line extension. Another important piece of context is that the 2nd Avenue line extension has had a terrible track record. It's been start-and-stop for many years. Earlier phases have come in behind schedule, over cost, and covered less distance than originally promised[5][6].
To avoid giving the wrong idea, I should emphasize that I am, in a vacuum, a big proponent of public transit. I think that public transit benefits everyone, and brings so much value above and beyond what it costs. Plenty of cities, internationally, demonstrate this time again, particularly in much of Europe and East Asia, and even some domestically in the US. NYC just isn't one of them. I'm also not upset at the MTA, merely disappointed.
I have observed elsewhere that it is extremely difficult to bootstrap competence where none currently exists, previously in the context of software engineering. This is extremely true for the MTA, also.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_transit_fares#Fa... [2]: The new OMNY "tap to pay" system is also less generous with its weekly discounts than the previously weekly MetroCard discounts. In practice, that's a further price hike for weekly commuters, above and beyond what the single ticket list price captures. [3]: https://pix11.com/news/transit/new-york-city-rider-survey-sh... [4]: https://ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/transit/2021/06/08/mta-nyc-... [5]: https://ny1.com/nyc/manhattan/2nd-ave-subway/2016/12/26/-a-s... [6]: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/31/nyregion/second-avenue-su...
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#9Is this not a very regressive tax? No billionaire in manhattan is going to feel this but every single cab driver, or blue collar worker will have to deal with this.
60% of people commuting to Manhattan use public transport.
And the percentage driving into this slice of Manhattan, which is probably among the most transit dense in the world, is likely even tinier.
For context, the highest congestion pricing toll is equivalent to 2 hrs of subsidized metered on street parking in this area.
The idea that the $9 congestion price is regressive needs to eliminate the 60% of people who don’t drive into the area at all.
Re: NYC Congestion Pricing Set to Take Effect After Years of Delays
#10An important piece of context, which might not be immediately apparent from this discussion, is that a vast majority of people in and around New York City dislike and distrust the MTA (NYC's public transit organization) to an extreme extent[3][4]. People widely view the MTA as ineffective and its spending as suspect. The MTA has more than doubled fares in recent years[1][2], yet has nothing to show for it. So, when a…
> The MTA has more than doubled fares in recent years[1][2], yet has nothing to show for it.
The current MTA fare is $2.90.
For it to be more than doubled it needs to have been lower than $1.45.
The last time the fare was lower than $1.45 was 1995. That’s hardly “recent years”.
Cumulative inflation since 1995 has been 107%, so basically the MTA hasn’t increased inflation adjusted fares since at least 1995.