Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
1–10 of 38 posts
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#2If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves.
Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#3If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves. Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Some damning bits if true:
> “Bosch made a calculated gamble to overpromise to multiple start-up electric vehicle companies on the theory that at least some of them would soon fail,” the lawsuit read.
> Rivian engineers said one of the lines was “in shambles” during a visit to Germany and claimed Bosch was not using “industry standard technology.”
Whether Chinese EVs ever make their way to US markets or not, the Chinese shift in consumer behavior and infrastructure there will eventually ripple out to South Korea and Japan and the US and EU will lose that fight with a mindset of denial.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#4If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves. Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Rivian also got in a dispute with Amazon when the latter wasn’t ordering enough delivery vans; as I understand it they tried to sell to others but Amazon had an exclusivity clause
Seems like some self inflicted wounds in an industry that can’t afford a slip
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#5If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves. Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Some damning bits if true: > “Bosch made a calculated gamble to overpromise to multiple start-up electric vehicle companies on the theory that at least some of them would soon fail,” the lawsuit read. > Rivian engineers said one of the lines was “in shambles” during a visit to Germany and claimed Bosch was not using “industry standard technology.” This coupled with BMW's recent pushback against EU ICE phaseout seems…
The legacy manufacturers are having a competition to see who can become the next Nokia.
The infotainment system, charging network and charging experience of a Tesla are still far ahead of the competition but I can’t tell why. There is literally a playbook to follow and they are all failing at it.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some damning bits if true: > “Bosch made a calculated gamble to overpromise to multiple start-up electric vehicle companies on the theory that at least some of them would soon fail,” the lawsuit read. > Rivian engineers said one of the lines was “in shambles” during a visit to Germany and claimed Bosch was not using “industry standard technology.” This coupled with BMW's recent pushback against EU ICE phaseout seems…
The legacy manufacturers are having a competition to see who can become the next Nokia. The infotainment system, charging network and charging experience of a Tesla are still far ahead of the competition but I can’t tell why. There is literally a playbook to follow and they are all failing at it.
My non-expert guesses:
- Investing capital for new manufacturing lines, retraining employees, hiring new employees, etc. means reduced profits and reduced short term returns for shareholders. The top level execs probably feel like their heads would be on the chopping block if investor returns were to be reduced in the short term for accelerating long term growth.
- A lot of entrenched mid-level and senior executives are simply protecting their turf. Similar to how Nadella completely turned around the mindset at Microsoft once Ballmer was ousted, I'd guess there are a lot of executives with fat paychecks that don't want to see their little empires diminished.
- Holding taxpayers hostage for government subsidies (to be fair, many electric startups did get the benefit). BMWs "threat" about reliance on the Chinese supply chain feels like a kind of strawman to get more subsidies.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#7If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves. Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Rivian also got in a dispute with Amazon when the latter wasn’t ordering enough delivery vans; as I understand it they tried to sell to others but Amazon had an exclusivity clause Seems like some self inflicted wounds in an industry that can’t afford a slip
Thankfully the exclusivity clause was finally dropped Nov of last year. Amazon has invested a lot of money into Rivian and if they want to recoup that investment it’s in their best interest not to needlessly hinder them.
Still hoping the R2 launch gets them into the mainstream and profitable.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#8If Bosch couldn't supply the motors required in the contact, I don't see why Rivian has to commit to not making motors themselves. Seems like the logical thing to do. If Kroger says they'll sell me 100,000 apples and only delivered 23k, I might buy an orchard
Rivian also got in a dispute with Amazon when the latter wasn’t ordering enough delivery vans; as I understand it they tried to sell to others but Amazon had an exclusivity clause Seems like some self inflicted wounds in an industry that can’t afford a slip
The Rivian delivery vehicles are super cool and futuristic.
Rivian is making some of the best looking EVs on the market.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#9Rivian have always struggled to bring down the cost of manufacturing their EVs. This is one of the biggest issues they have when you are making an EV battery & motor are 2 of the most important components of the car. In Rivians case they both are sourced and not done in-house. They got carried away making a luxurious car, custom screen setup (rather then leveraging Carplay or Android Auto) & good looking interior. If you want to be in a profitable in first place they should done total inverse, focus on making a great battery & motor like Tesla did and try to source out other things. This is one of the reasons why BYD and Chinese EV companies are destroying all their competition, they do majority of things in-house.
Re: Rivian (RIVN) clashes with Bosch in new legal battle over EV motors
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some damning bits if true: > “Bosch made a calculated gamble to overpromise to multiple start-up electric vehicle companies on the theory that at least some of them would soon fail,” the lawsuit read. > Rivian engineers said one of the lines was “in shambles” during a visit to Germany and claimed Bosch was not using “industry standard technology.” This coupled with BMW's recent pushback against EU ICE phaseout seems…
The legacy manufacturers are having a competition to see who can become the next Nokia. The infotainment system, charging network and charging experience of a Tesla are still far ahead of the competition but I can’t tell why. There is literally a playbook to follow and they are all failing at it.
They're producing what people want to buy. Used EV prices are in freefall. I'm not saying that's a good thing it's just the way it is.