3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
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3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
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Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#2Given we have a recent law regarding data breaches, notifications, and penalties for not...
We ought to mirror this law onto IRL products and companies
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#3This is what happens when the EPA's rules state chemical companies, can more or less, police themselves.
We've detected PFOAs in rainwater/clouds, in the artic, etc (See https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c02765)
They are going to lead to further health problems down the road.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#4This is what happens when the EPA's rules state chemical companies, can more or less, police themselves. We've detected PFOAs in rainwater/clouds, in the artic, etc (See https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c02765 ) They are going to lead to further health problems down the road.
This kind of self regulation can probably work and be cost effective if you ruthlessly destroy any company found in violation rather than some fine and an apology.
Reminds me of criminal punishment in medieval times. Incarceration was a complete economic non-start so the penalties were brutal as a deterrent.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#5I increasingly think we need personal criminal liability for everyone in the management chain before this will end.
As long as you can cash out your options before the reckoning, maybe even spin a division out to go bankrupt, there are just too many people who’ll chase the larger number. You need the guy who gets that internal memo to think that if he doesn’t report it to the EPA, he’ll spend the rest of his life wondering whether the knock on the door is the FBI.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#6I increasingly think we need personal criminal liability for everyone in the management chain before this will end. As long as you can cash out your options before the reckoning, maybe even spin a division out to go bankrupt, there are just too many people who’ll chase the larger number. You need the guy who gets that internal memo to think that if he doesn’t report it to the EPA, he’ll spend the rest of his life won…
In China, there was a case of baby formula execs (Edit: pointed out to me further down thread that the execs were only jailed for 5-15 years with Sanlu's general manager receiving a life sentence, and the people executed very those directly responsible for tainting the product mentioned) knowingly selling product that was harmful and led to tens of thousands of hospitalizations and a handful of deaths. They were executed. Perhaps this type of incentive will lead to less harmful outcomes vs limited liability and the corporate veil.
At some point, you’re doing enough harm knowingly at scale that monetary damages and prison are insufficient.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#7I increasingly think we need personal criminal liability for everyone in the management chain before this will end. As long as you can cash out your options before the reckoning, maybe even spin a division out to go bankrupt, there are just too many people who’ll chase the larger number. You need the guy who gets that internal memo to think that if he doesn’t report it to the EPA, he’ll spend the rest of his life won…
Up to and including capital punishment. If something like this causes deaths for example, it should be treated like murder.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#8Ever wonder if things like this lead to companies intentionally avoiding environmental research? We need to find some way to align our interests, this seems like a dead end path. We are unintentionally incentivizing the disruption of environmental research.
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#9I increasingly think we need personal criminal liability for everyone in the management chain before this will end. As long as you can cash out your options before the reckoning, maybe even spin a division out to go bankrupt, there are just too many people who’ll chase the larger number. You need the guy who gets that internal memo to think that if he doesn’t report it to the EPA, he’ll spend the rest of his life won…
Up to and including capital punishment. If something like this causes deaths for example, it should be treated like murder.
"I'll believe corporations are people when Texas executes one"
Re: 3M knew its chemicals were harmful decades ago, but didn't tell the public
#10I increasingly think we need personal criminal liability for everyone in the management chain before this will end. As long as you can cash out your options before the reckoning, maybe even spin a division out to go bankrupt, there are just too many people who’ll chase the larger number. You need the guy who gets that internal memo to think that if he doesn’t report it to the EPA, he’ll spend the rest of his life won…
In China, there was a case of baby formula execs (Edit: pointed out to me further down thread that the execs were only jailed for 5-15 years with Sanlu's general manager receiving a life sentence, and the people executed very those directly responsible for tainting the product mentioned) knowingly selling product that was harmful and led to tens of thousands of hospitalizations and a handful of deaths. They were exec…
Yeah, I’m generally opposed to the death penalty on the grounds of not being able to undo mistakes but if we’re going to have it on the books, I’d have a hard time saying that shouldn’t be an option. We’ve charged plenty of people for killing a single person, and the numbers for food safety can be a lot more than that.