Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

The article discusses how agonizing it must be for a guesser when they have to say no to something. But something I have been dealing with recently is actually the reverse—the resentment a guesser feels when told “no”. Because in their mind, they have done the math and think they have correctly deduced they should receive a “yes”. Forthwrmore, since they don’t like saying “no”, they project this on their rejector and take it personally.

As a diehard “asker” I can’t help but see “guessing” as narcissistic. Why would you presume you know what I want? Of course from the other side “asking” can be seen as self centered—why can’t they read the room?

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#7

Post by dav_Oz » Thu, Sep 07, 2023, 6:03 PM UTC

While Japan is the most obvious "Guess culture" for Westerners.

My favourite example of a "Guess culture" is that of Iranian taarof[0]:

Another example occurs if a Western individual is not familiar with taarof in Iranian culture. When an Iranian individual is offering taarof, it is to first view it as a sincere offer with the hope of decline up to four or five times. If the individual offers more than five times, it can be concluded that the individual is not doing taarof, and the opposite side should respectfully thank that individual and accept the offer with gratitude.

In that example one has to decline about 5 times (!) to be sure the offer is genuine, most people unfamiliar with that custom will take the offer the second or third time or will be enraged that they don't understand a "No, thank you".

The most laborious combination is a "genuine offer" and you deciding to decline it. The person signaling the genuine offer will try to double down, - so expect an 8th time - until your genuine rejection is "accepted" and while you are at it firmly holding your ground try to sneak in a counter-offer, too ;) In the end you will end up most likely accepting a "symbolic offer" of the genuine offer. E.g. if you decline a ride you are offered genuinely (say because you want to have a comfortable ride with a taxi), you can decline eventually by accepting the symbolic offer that e.g. a taxi is called up for you.

Pretty hard to figure out if you are coming from an ask culture.

[0]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taarof

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#8

Post by bibanez » Thu, Sep 07, 2023, 6:17 PM UTC

timeagain wrote: post #6

The article discusses how agonizing it must be for a guesser when they have to say no to something. But something I have been dealing with recently is actually the reverse—the resentment a guesser feels when told “no”. Because in their mind, they have done the math and think they have correctly deduced they should receive a “yes”. Forthwrmore, since they don’t like saying “no”, they project this on their rejector and…

As someone from a guesser culture, being nice is refreshing. I enjoy giving surprises and not expecting something in return. It's different when you're at a dinner party and someone doesn't collaborate or collaborates very little, because we expect everyone to know about the shared burdens. The thing with this system is that it allows for more flexibility when everyone is on the same page! We're not narcicisstic, I swear!

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#9

Post by pdonis » Thu, Sep 07, 2023, 6:24 PM UTC

bibanez wrote: post #8

timeagain wrote: post #6

The article discusses how agonizing it must be for a guesser when they have to say no to something. But something I have been dealing with recently is actually the reverse—the resentment a guesser feels when told “no”. Because in their mind, they have done the math and think they have correctly deduced they should receive a “yes”. Forthwrmore, since they don’t like saying “no”, they project this on their rejector and…

As someone from a guesser culture, being nice is refreshing. I enjoy giving surprises and not expecting something in return. It's different when you're at a dinner party and someone doesn't collaborate or collaborates very little, because we expect everyone to know about the shared burdens. The thing with this system is that it allows for more flexibility when everyone is on the same page! We're not narcicisstic, I s…

> it allows for more flexibility when everyone is on the same page

Yes, but that qualifier is crucial, as the Metafilter post referenced upthread points out: "Guess behaviors only work among a subset of other Guess people -- ones who share a fairly specific set of expectations and signalling techniques. The farther you get from your own family and friends and subculture, the more you'll have to embrace Ask behavior."

In fact, as the scenario described in the Metafilter thread shows, even sharing considerable background doesn't always make Guess work. The wife and the friend in the scenario were from the same home town and knew each other's families, but the wife's attempts to hint, in Guess fashion, that the friend wasn't a welcome visitor didn't take, and now the wife and husband are struggling with the (necessary in this case) switch to Ask behavior (or more precisely the correct Ask response, which is to Just Say No instead of hinting).

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#10

Post by 0xfae » Thu, Sep 07, 2023, 6:28 PM UTC

dav_Oz wrote: post #7

While Japan is the most obvious "Guess culture" for Westerners. My favourite example of a "Guess culture" is that of Iranian taarof[0]: Another example occurs if a Western individual is not familiar with taarof in Iranian culture. When an Iranian individual is offering taarof, it is to first view it as a sincere offer with the hope of decline up to four or five times. If the individual offers more than five times, it…

As someone who grew up in America (typically ask culture) but also grew up in a very guess culture family, subculture and religion (Utah Mormons), this seems insane to me. I grew up guess culture so I understand it, but ask culture is so much clearer/concise/kinder in my opinion. Less likely to be misunderstood and build resentment, etc.

The wikipedia article states the "Taarof is a ritual politeness that levels the playing field and promotes equality in a hierarchical culture" but the expectation that you repeatedly say no to something that is being offered and that you want out of social nicety seems nonsensical, and I don't see how it promotes equality. Can someone shed some light on this?