A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#1

Post by JerusaEnt » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 6:26 AM UTC

In Judaism, you are not allowed to use electricity on Saturday. So this company made a light switch that according to them (and granted, many others) IS allowed to be used on Saturday. So I thought HN would like the way it works to try to get around things.

If your interested in seeing why this is allowed on Saturday as opposed to a normal light, if you go to Halacha>>Halacha: overview, it goes through it

A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading
kosherswitch.com

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#2

Post by kichuku88 » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 6:53 AM UTC

Hi. I am not Jewish (I am in a country with hardly any Jews) and I do not know what relation there is to electrical switched to a religious day.

Sorry for being ignorant. But can you please explain in simple words what is need for this for Jews?

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#3

Post by neilk » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:24 AM UTC

kichuku88 wrote: post #2

Hi. I am not Jewish (I am in a country with hardly any Jews) and I do not know what relation there is to electrical switched to a religious day. Sorry for being ignorant. But can you please explain in simple words what is need for this for Jews?

There are religious proscriptions against doing work on the Sabbath (for Jews, beginning Friday at sundown and lasting until Saturday evening). These include lighting a fire. Some religious authorities believe that completing an electric light is the modern equivalent.

Thus, there is an entire industry of elaborate contraptions to allow the observant Orthodox Jew all of the convenience with none of the covenant-breaking. Like this switch, which doesn't create an electric circuit; it blocks an intermittent light pulse which has some possibility of not even doing anything.

Allegedly this is more acceptable to the Almighty. Perhaps because the Torah lacks an anti-circumvention clause.

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#4

Post by notphilatall » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:26 AM UTC

Quick explanation: In orthodox judaism, one is not supposed to operate a light-switch on the Sabbath.

I'm not jewish, but some of my friends are observant (but progressive) and use the Sabbath as a day of reflection. This seems to completely go against the spirit of the rule (to spend a day living simply with friends and family, without technology for maximum reflection, introspection, and rest).

I don't see how this gadget would catch on -- unless someone is bound is follow the rule to the letter, but doesn't really want to (but then at that point, they should just stop adhering IMHO)

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#5

Post by MiguelHudnandez » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:28 AM UTC

kichuku88 wrote: post #2

Hi. I am not Jewish (I am in a country with hardly any Jews) and I do not know what relation there is to electrical switched to a religious day. Sorry for being ignorant. But can you please explain in simple words what is need for this for Jews?

As far as I understand it, some orthodox jews are not permitted to do any "work" on the sabbath.

Some factions believe that flicking a light switch is "work," or that pressing a button is "work." So some enterprising fellows have been creating ingenious inventions to allow observant orthodox jews to live comfortably while still not technically violating their rules.

It all seems pretty silly to me, but you have to admit, it is indeed hacking and I think the devices are clever.

One specific example is an elevator, which has a sabbath mode. On the sabbath, it will stop and open its doors at every floor, over and over, so that an observant rider can simply walk on, and walk off at their desired floor, without the perceived sin of pressing the button for their floor.

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#6

Post by howardr » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:33 AM UTC

MiguelHudnandez wrote: post #5

kichuku88 wrote: post #2

Hi. I am not Jewish (I am in a country with hardly any Jews) and I do not know what relation there is to electrical switched to a religious day. Sorry for being ignorant. But can you please explain in simple words what is need for this for Jews?

As far as I understand it, some orthodox jews are not permitted to do any "work" on the sabbath. Some factions believe that flicking a light switch is "work," or that pressing a button is "work." So some enterprising fellows have been creating ingenious inventions to allow observant orthodox jews to live comfortably while still not technically violating their rules. It all seems pretty silly to me, but you have to ad…

One of my friends said that his grandparents would light their stove before sundown on friday and leave it lit until sundown Saturday so they would not break kosher laws

I have also heard that a lot of devices have kosher mode. E.g. refrigerators lights not coming on and power randomly going in and out much like this swith

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#7

Post by JerusaEnt » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:34 AM UTC

notphilatall wrote: post #4

Quick explanation: In orthodox judaism, one is not supposed to operate a light-switch on the Sabbath. I'm not jewish, but some of my friends are observant (but progressive) and use the Sabbath as a day of reflection. This seems to completely go against the spirit of the rule (to spend a day living simply with friends and family, without technology for maximum reflection, introspection, and rest). I don't see how this…

I am Jewish.

So I can tell you that you are 100% right. I don't think this is really going to catch on for that very reason. Sabbath is a day set aside for family, religion, and not working.

I think what the main use is going to be is people will install it for emergencies. So I'm sure in Israel a lot of people will put it in their bomb shelters so if they need to spend Sabbath in the shelter and need to use the light, it won't be directly going against Sabbath.

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#8

Post by JerusaEnt » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 7:37 AM UTC

MiguelHudnandez wrote: post #5

kichuku88 wrote: post #2

Hi. I am not Jewish (I am in a country with hardly any Jews) and I do not know what relation there is to electrical switched to a religious day. Sorry for being ignorant. But can you please explain in simple words what is need for this for Jews?

As far as I understand it, some orthodox jews are not permitted to do any "work" on the sabbath. Some factions believe that flicking a light switch is "work," or that pressing a button is "work." So some enterprising fellows have been creating ingenious inventions to allow observant orthodox jews to live comfortably while still not technically violating their rules. It all seems pretty silly to me, but you have to ad…

Another "hack" us Jews use very often is a timer. We have a timer hooked up to an outlet, and plug things into the timer, so you can set certain times to allow the electricity through, and other times not to.

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#9

Post by emmelaich » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 8:05 AM UTC

JerusaEnt wrote: post #7

notphilatall wrote: post #4

Quick explanation: In orthodox judaism, one is not supposed to operate a light-switch on the Sabbath. I'm not jewish, but some of my friends are observant (but progressive) and use the Sabbath as a day of reflection. This seems to completely go against the spirit of the rule (to spend a day living simply with friends and family, without technology for maximum reflection, introspection, and rest). I don't see how this…

I am Jewish. So I can tell you that you are 100% right. I don't think this is really going to catch on for that very reason. Sabbath is a day set aside for family, religion, and not working. I think what the main use is going to be is people will install it for emergencies. So I'm sure in Israel a lot of people will put it in their bomb shelters so if they need to spend Sabbath in the shelter and need to use the ligh…

> will install it for emergencies

Surely use in emergencies is allowed already.

(I am not Jewish, but I heard an Oy Vey once)

Re: A roundabout way of turning on a light. See the explanation b4 reading

#10

Post by corin_ » Fri, Feb 17, 2012, 8:23 AM UTC

JerusaEnt wrote: post #8

MiguelHudnandez wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I understand it, some orthodox jews are not permitted to do any "work" on the sabbath. Some factions believe that flicking a light switch is "work," or that pressing a button is "work." So some enterprising fellows have been creating ingenious inventions to allow observant orthodox jews to live comfortably while still not technically violating their rules. It all seems pretty silly to me, but you have to ad…

Another "hack" us Jews use very often is a timer. We have a timer hooked up to an outlet, and plug things into the timer, so you can set certain times to allow the electricity through, and other times not to.

It seems to me that "hacks" like these are just missing the point - though I'm an atheist, so maybe I'm just missing the point.

If the logic is that God didn't want a fire lit, surely that is because he didn't want the fire, not that he didn't want someone lighting it.

Isn't it all a little bit like a scaled down, less immoral, version of saying "No, I didn't kill him, I just pushed him into the ocean - blame the water"?